Porn in Writing

[Prince_Azmiran_Myrian]

Sorry to dirty your discussion with my lack of depth.

Oh the video was compulsory viewing, you should have said.

But not retract it by

I had assumed wrongly this is just a causal conversation. And I didnt need to do any homework.


But
"Oh? You didnt even educate yourself with my awesome video?!?"

I will see myself out, I of the common ilk have no place in these dizzy peaks of high intellectual pristine white towers.

You're unreasonably mad about it, but ok. I see your point.

 

[Enkiari]

... This has devolved to the point bickering.
Don't make me search for a sign to tap on.

 

[Prince_Azmiran_Myrian]

... This has devolved to the point bickering.
Don't make me search for a sign to tap on.

If you think this is pointless bickering, just wait. Man have you got your work cut out for you.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

Ban violence first.

This, but I will elaborate a little bit. Will speak for myself only, not for K5.

So, personally, I never saw a person making a thread like this about violence. I won't exagerrate and say it never happens, I didn't see it once. Meanwhile threads about porn or smut being bad appear a lot on SH. Let's move on from SH and talk about life in general. The amount of ban violence topics I saw against ban porn makes me think people only want to destroy things. Sure, there are odd 'activist' groups that will ask to ban violent games... what about violent books? Violent movies? Violent sports?

You see, I don't understand how we all agree that violence is bad, yet we don't deal with it at all. Ok, people will disagree, so I will speak for myself. Violence is bad, I personally think everyone agrees on it, it is 'openly' bad, yet no one deals with it at all. How come porn that is probably 'veiled' bad, I assume you think people don't understand porn is evil, is regulated more, yet something openly evil isn't regulated at all? Make it make sense. Seriously.

"We have to deal with porn first" is such a weak ass argument, it's not even worth looking at. Why people don't try to deal with violence, or when they do it is super selective? Banning a couple of 'violent' games is not equal to saying all porn is evil. This is where I will get into schizo conspiracy theory. Because violence sells more, and if someone says let's ban ALL violence they will be seen psychopaths.

Seriously, let's say we ban all porn. It consists of, well, obviously porn videos, books that are mostly popular among women and teens... What else? A couple of movies, a couple of songs.

Meanwhile let's see what we will lose if we ban all violence. In top 10 highest grossing movies of all time we lose 8. If we look at movies in general, we lose at the very least 50% of ALL movies. Same for books. A lot of extremely popular musicians get their songs banned. No more american footbal either, it is based on violence. Basketball and hockey get neutered, if you touch other player you get banned for life. No more MMA, no more boxing. And I am sure many more things that I forgot.

Let's take our beloved Japan as an example. Does a very 'progressive' country that manafactures porn books(hentai) and porn movies in large quantitites profits more from porn or from violence? Well, if you look at best selling manga and compare it to hentai, it honestly looks laughable. You compare violent manga that sold 100+ mill copies to hentai that COLLECTIVELY sold maybe 100mil at max. You compate billions of sales made on violence with maybe a hundred mils on sex.

Well, what about porn movies? Did they make more than Japanese movies about violence? I doubt. What about if you include sports? Karate, MMA, Judo? Sumo??? Sumo is super popular and makes a ton of money. There is no secret porn sport you can try and use to compare to violent sports either.

What about games? C'mon. Just try and compare 'popular' hentai VNs and games like Dark Souls, Final Fantasy, Pokemon(btw it is violent) and so on.

So yeah, answering the question why people don't want to deal with violence. If you(generic you) want all violence blocked, you will probably be seen as a lunatic, that's why. Because it is socially acceptable to demonize porn, but it is not socially acceptable to demonize violence. If not, answer, how come I've not seen a single thread about banning violence, yet at least three threads about banning porn.

Make it make sense.

 

[DireBadger]

On a site such as this one (Scribble Hub) I have often seen discussions on how smut does/doesn't dominate the front page or site or whatever. Pornography in all mediums has seen a wide spread over the last few decades, and it's obvious why. But that's not exactly what I am here to discuss at all.

I want to know whether people here think the normalization of adult entertainment is a good thing or not. The poll above is anonymous for this reason, I want people to answer truly without having to embarrass or out themselves. Of course, you can post replies if you have strong beliefs in this area and wish to argue in one way or another or to state your opinion and reason openly.

I saw this video a little while ago, but seeing it mentioned somewhere else kindled this idea to start this thread here. Have a gander if you are interested on some more intellectual discussion. (I cannot provide that.) It is based more on the mainstream publishing world in America, but i think the ideas will hold true more widely.

My personal belief is that porn is evil and should be banned. It is hard to elaborate on the reasons, as religion is not acceptable to post about on this site. However, porn not only destroys individuals but also societies. My opinion on a little smut is that it ruins the whole thing. If I wanted to read porn I would go read a porn book. stop sneaking it into an otherwise normal story.

So anyways, what is Scribble Hub forum's opinion on this matter?

That is complicated, and leads to a very deep discussion on social harmfulness, attitudes, and even sexual roles. The problem is that arguments CAN and WILL lead to people getting banned, because certain physical and historical realities, as well as unpopular side effects of the growing influence of AI, lead to conclusions that are political nukes.

So, umm... best to pretend it doesn't exist, and stockpile emergency food and ammunition. The Overton window has shifted far, far to the left, and it always, historically, shifts back to the right in a hail of abomination, blood, and death.

Meanwhile, we Gen Xers are stockpiling popcorn because power skipped right from boomers to millennials (we are still outnumbered 5 to 1). The boomers destroyed the family, and we just screwed up because we were never taught how to be parents.

So... we plan to munch popcorn as we watch the world burn, and hope generation Zyklon can set things straight after we are dead.

 

[Amelia-chan]

Ban violence first.

The thing about violence is that it’s mean to an end while porn is not.

 

[RepresentingDesire]

I think porn itself does no real harm, it's something that is about portraying physical love which would be genuinely harmful to society if not talked about and educated about, but porn is rather separate to such teachings.

I consider porn addiction a symptom of a society where through others means physical love can not be found, it's like only watching happy things because there is the only happiness for one, a society of fanatic chastity and shame fuels porn as much as one where love can not be found.

Googling 'mighty lewd books' should be helpful to understand my point.

Some might say that gooning would fall under porn addiction but I would argue it's the porn equivalent of doom scrolling because I literally don't know why it wouldn't be, I consider it still doom scrolling which I would call the far larger problem.



Furthermore I would consider normalization something good due to the implications of it, if it becomes normal it loses a lot about what made it problematic, like criminal actions around it become harder to do and the content itself would probably lose a lot of what made it problematic to appeal to a larger audience.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

Small update. I finished the video. You know what is funny? She said nothing about violence being bad, also made no videos about violence being bad. ?‍

 

[ThisAdamGuy]

I know SH's reputation, so I know asking to ban porn wouldnt work, and I wouldn't do that anyway because I think people should be able to write what they want (excluding obvious things like pedophilia). That being said, I think a lot of SH's writers (heck, writers in general) use sex as a crutch to make up for mediocre writing. Yeah, we all say we're above consuming trash just because it has sex appeal, but there's a disturbing number of people who, if you give them a well written book with no sex and a mediocre book with sex, they'll choose the mediocre book "bcuz boobies lol!". It's the same reason super talented SFW artists can struggle to get commissions, but Thumbless Theo can make a better living than 90% of America because he can kinda sorta draw a pair of nipples.

 

[RepresentingDesire]

The thing about violence is that it’s mean to an end while porn is not.

All entertainment is a means to an end including porn, in the context of entertainment both are essentially the same, both are in their own ways if done right able to evoke emotions, bring enjoyment and further the plot. Then again that's true for every plot point because that's what porn and violence are at the end.

If we want to talk about real life it's important to know that porn includes sex which is more important than any form of violence will ever be, you can't defend children that don't exist, creativity during sex that is shown in porn can make love in it's own ways enjoyable as well. I'm the first to say that simple kisses and hand holding or similar expressions of love can be important in a relationship, but at the end of the day porn includes mostly expressions of love, it's possibility to strip values from everything including the most 'wholesome' forms of love.

But most porn is legal and even some more violent forms involve consent, most violence is illegal and done without any form of willingness from one side to be violent, that's true in entertainment and irl. Consent is really important.

 

[Prince_Azmiran_Myrian]

This, but I will elaborate a little bit. Will speak for myself only, not for K5.

So, personally, I never saw a person making a thread like this about violence. I won't exagerrate and say it never happens, I didn't see it once. Meanwhile threads about porn or smut being bad appear a lot on SH. Let's move on from SH and talk about life in general. The amount of ban violence topics I saw against ban porn makes me think people only want to destroy things. Sure, there are odd 'activist' groups that will ask to ban violent games... what about violent books? Violent movies? Violent sports?

You see, I don't understand how we all agree that violence is bad, yet we don't deal with it at all. Ok, people will disagree, so I will speak for myself. Violence is bad, I personally think everyone agrees on it, it is 'openly' bad, yet no one deals with it at all. How come porn that is probably 'veiled' bad, I assume you think people don't understand porn is evil, is regulated more, yet something openly evil isn't regulated at all? Make it make sense. Seriously.

"We have to deal with porn first" is such a weak ass argument, it's not even worth looking at. Why people don't try to deal with violence, or when they do it is super selective? Banning a couple of 'violent' games is not equal to saying all porn is evil. This is where I will get into schizo conspiracy theory. Because violence sells more, and if someone says let's ban ALL violence they will be seen psychopaths.

Seriously, let's say we ban all porn. It consists of, well, obviously porn videos, books that are mostly popular among women and teens... What else? A couple of movies, a couple of songs.

Meanwhile let's see what we will lose if we ban all violence. In top 10 highest grossing movies of all time we lose 8. If we look at movies in general, we lose at the very least 50% of ALL movies. Same for books. A lot of extremely popular musicians get their songs banned. No more american footbal either, it is based on violence. Basketball and hockey get neutered, if you touch other player you get banned for life. No more MMA, no more boxing. And I am sure many more things that I forgot.

Let's take our beloved Japan as an example. Does a very 'progressive' country that manafactures porn books(hentai) and porn movies in large quantitites profits more from porn or from violence? Well, if you look at best selling manga and compare it to hentai, it honestly looks laughable. You compare violent manga that sold 100+ mill copies to hentai that COLLECTIVELY sold maybe 100mil at max. You compate billions of sales made on violence with maybe a hundred mils on sex.

Well, what about porn movies? Did they make more than Japanese movies about violence? I doubt. What about if you include sports? Karate, MMA, Judo? Sumo??? Sumo is super popular and makes a ton of money. There is no secret porn sport you can try and use to compare to violent sports either.

What about games? C'mon. Just try and compare 'popular' hentai VNs and games like Dark Souls, Final Fantasy, Pokemon(btw it is violent) and so on.

So yeah, answering the question why people don't want to deal with violence. If you(generic you) want all violence blocked, you will probably be seen as a lunatic, that's why. Because it is socially acceptable to demonize porn, but it is not socially acceptable to demonize violence. If not, answer, how come I've not seen a single thread about banning violence, yet at least three threads about banning porn.

Make it make sense.

Look who's triggered. But since you are asking i will give an answer. It's not the full answer since religion is banned, but I will give secular reasons which you will not accept.

To get straight to the point, because promiscuity has a far worse effect than depictions of violence. Similar to as I said in OP, promiscuity destroys individuals and society. It is subtle but devastating.
You site the prevalence of violence, but that proves to highlight how low the impact of it is. Now there is gratuitous violence, which might should be curtailed.
If you were to make a poll based on violence which mirrored this one, i would choose "Less violence, it is bad."

And before you say violence does the same, I agree. Just not depictions of violence, fictitious violence does little to individuals and society. What you mean is real violence. Promiscuity is real in fiction and in action.

Let me ask a question which may be out of left field and will probably anger you because of implications. But why do people who think porn is fine also agree on banning child porn? And I mean fictitious children, not real ones. Can you explain to me why fictitious child porn should be banned before violence should be?

 

[RepresentingDesire]

Let me ask a question which may be out of left field and will probably anger you because of implications. But why do people who think porn is fine also agree on banning child porn? And I mean fictitious children, not real ones. Can you explain to me why fictitious child porn should be banned before violence should be?

I would give the same answer as I would give for the depictions of serial killers, as long as the author makes it clear that it is a bad thing, I personally think reading about such thinks if they are executed well can be informative.

Understanding why something happens can lead to having better preemptive measures which can lead to a decrease in cases of a given situation, even when it comes to abusive behaviors. I would die on the hill that being ignorant of the ways of pain and admonishing those who try to understand is societies greatest sin.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

Look who's triggered.

When I give short answers, you say I have nothing to say and am 'guilty by omission'. When I give elaborated answer, I am triggered. ?‍

To get straight to the point, because promiscuity has a far worse effect than depictions of violence.

Well, I disagree, completely. And this is another reason why I am me, and you are you. And I don't do the same thing as you, I hope you get what I mean here. I think both are equally bad. There are not enough studies in the whole world that will change my opinion.

You site the prevalence of violence, but that proves to highlight how low the impact of it is.

The same argument can be send back to you. Things that are bad for health that you attribute to porn I can attribute to violence.

Let me ask a question which may be out of left field and will probably anger you because of implications. But why do people who think porn is fine also agree on banning child porn? And I mean fictitious children, not real ones. Can you explain to me why fictitious child porn should be banned before violence should be?

This doesn't anger me, nor does it make any implications, might miss them. As for why, I think the same reason MMA fights and boxing, 'controlled' violence are battles NOT to death.

 

[Prince_Azmiran_Myrian]

When I give short answers, you say I have nothing to say and am 'guilty by omission'. When I give elaborated answer, I am triggered. ?‍

Well, that's not the reason I say you're triggered...

Well, I disagree, completely. And this is another reason why I am me, and you are you. And I don't do the same thing as you, I hope you get what I mean here. I think both are equally bad.

There are not enough studies in the whole world that will change my opinion.

This is closer to why I say you are triggered. Because the argument you made was irrational. Even if violence was banned, you'd still defend porn. Bringing up violence as a way to shut down the debate is just a redirection, it doesn't address the issue I brought up.
As you said, its your opinion, but my belief against porn and promiscuity is not based on my own opinion.

The same argument can be send back to you. Things that are bad for health that you attribute to porn I can attribute to violence.

Ok, just try to attribute fictional violence as a cause to real violence.
On the flip side, yeah fictional promiscuity encourages encourages real promiscuity.
or perhaps, it is a symptom of real promiscuity. Well, I am opposed to both anyway. There is a possibility I am approaching the issue from the wrong end.

This doesn't anger me, nor does it make any implications, might miss them. As for why, I think the same reason MMA fights and boxing, 'controlled' violence are battles NOT to death.

Because people do not want to die irl? I don't see how that's the same reason at all.

 

[Enkiari]

Let's end it here. I feel like this is getting a little too personal.
I don't think there will be a satisfying conclusion to this discussion as the viewpoints differ too much.