Weak Protagonist, OP Protagonist, or somewhere in between?

[AnonUnlimited]

Yeah, nobody knows what that is. Gundam? Is that the thing about robots?

It's about a vampire mommy goddess and her child.
It has smut, but in the end the vampire hunter wins by destroying that incestuous relationship.

 

[SouthernMaiden]

For web novels, where you have to keep reader attention. Making a non-op protagonist (or one who doesn't have some sort of cheat) often taxes the reader with tension. Generally, if you have the entire story like how traditional novels are written, the tension can be passed on as you go through it, but for web novels that go on for years and have no guaranteed updates, it's annoying to read a tension filled story.

That's an interesting perspective. Usually tension is a great feeling that you want to create in readers. Surely there can be a balance without having an MC who's OP from the get go.

Yeah, nobody knows what that is. Gundam? Is that the thing about robots?

Gundam is about the horrors of war. I was honestly surprised when I watched it for the first time, like damn it was not the happy robot show I was expecting

 

[AnonUnlimited]

That's an interesting perspective. Usually tension is a great feeling that you want to create in readers. Surely there can be a balance without having an MC who's OP from the get go.

Tension is great in short bursts.
But who the hell wants to have constant tension just to follow along a protagonist?
I find that when protagnists make dumb mistakes in movies, it's far more forgivable than if they make dumb mistakes in a webnovel that then takes months to be rectified.

You can see it in the comments often.

 

[SouthernMaiden]

Tension is great in short bursts.
But who the hell wants to have constant tension just to follow along a protagonist?
I find that when protagnists make dumb mistakes in movies, it's far more forgivable than if they make dumb mistakes in a webnovel that then takes months to be rectified.

You can see it in the comments often.

Good point. I've read some books that were absolutely miserable. But at the end of the day were still worth reading because at most they just took a couple weeks. If I had to read something "challenging", split over months. I probably would just not lol.

 

[Eldoria]

Tsuujou Kougeki ga Zentai Kougeki de Ni-kai Kougeki no Okaa-san wa Suki desu ka? - Novel Updates

www.novelupdates.com

That is the last fiction I will read. I prefer the type of mother like Cayna and Azusa.

 

[Miryuu]

I like OP protagonist that's never truly Invincible, just outrageously strong but never truly becoming Ultimate no.1

Like a Protagonist in an Increasingly Competitive Endless Hierarchy type of World, i want an MC that lived as "Phoenix tails instead of Chicken Head" ("Weakest among Strongest List of All Time instead of Strongest among Ordinary Common Folks)

Like they could be a 1 in a Hundred Years Cultivations Genius in some cultivation novel at his hometown, but then when they Rises to fame, he/she suddenly realizes that it's just being best no.1 among most Mediocre Nation, & there are alots of Nations & Genius like him.

Like they realizes that there's over Ten Thoudands of Nations in a World Region, & there's also Ten Thousand Year Genius in a Region, so he/she are 10.000×100 = Millions of times far more mediocre than that Strongest Epochal Genius (Epoch = 10.000 Years)

When the new goal are Achieved & they became the Epochal Genius, millions of time better than Earlier chapter, they realize it again that there's over 10.000 World Regions in a Planet & Hundred Thousand Years old Genius also exist, then it repeat as there's over 10.000 Big Cultivation planet in a Galaxy & then there's Great Emperor that's born only 1 within millions of Years, repeat it again there's Immortal Realm, Immortal King, Immortal Emperor, Immortal Sage, Etcs.

 

[Sylver]

Weak at first, strong by the end

 

[SouthernMaiden]

I like OP protagonist that's never truly Invincible, just outrageously strong but never truly becoming Ultimate no.1

Like a Protagonist in an Increasingly Competitive Endless Hierarchy type of World, i want an MC that lived as "Phoenix tails instead of Chicken Head" ("Weakest among Strongest List of All Time instead of Strongest among Ordinary Common Folks)

Like they could be a 1 in a Hundred Years Cultivations Genius in some cultivation novel at his hometown, but then when they Rises to fame, he/she suddenly realizes that it's just being best no.1 among most Mediocre Nation, & there are alots of Nations & Genius like him.

Like they realizes that there's over Ten Thoudands of Nations in a World Region, & there's also Ten Thousand Year Genius in a Region, so he/she are 10.000×100 = Millions of times far more mediocre than that Strongest Epochal Genius (Epoch = 10.000 Years)

When the new goal are Achieved & they became the Epochal Genius, millions of time better than Earlier chapter, they realize it again that there's over 10.000 World Regions in a Planet & Hundred Thousand Years old Genius also exist, then it repeat as there's over 10.000 Big Cultivation planet in a Galaxy & then there's Great Emperor that's born only 1 within millions of Years, repeat it again there's Immortal Realm, Immortal King, Immortal Emperor, Immortal Sage, Etcs.

I know what you mean. I can think of a couple stories that kinda do this. Like they become the strongest in their village, then they fight people from other villages and realize they're not that strong. But eventually they overcome that, then fight people from other nations ect.

 

[Eldoria]

I hate how people bring up or think about inappropriate terms when we bring the word "mother" nowadays.

Well, some people use fiction to channel their Oedipus complex. Honestly, it's a bit creepy. We don't see mothers like that even in fiction; after all, it's our mothers who give birth to us (unless someone is born from a rock like Sun Wukong).

 

[SouthernMaiden]

Weak at first, strong by the end

What's your fav example?

 

[Macha]

Well, some people use fiction to channel their Oedipus complex. Honestly, it's a bit creepy. We don't see mothers like that even in fiction; after all, it's our mothers who give birth to us (unless someone is born from a rock like Sun Wukong).

Idk. I always think my grandma is the one who give birth to me and my mom is my sister because she never acted like a mom.

Maybe it's because her mom never acted like a mom because she never know how a mom should act because she never have one and now is a bad influence.

Or it's just the way everyone think we are sisters when they saw us outside and she just let them think that to screw with them. The worse part is thinking my dad either enable that behavior because he thought it was funny or he like it when women act half their age. But he is retarded so I think he just forgot my mom is not young anymore like she forgot how to age.

Is it the mind influencing the body or is it the body influencing the mind?

 

[Miryuu]

Idk. I always think my grandma is the one who give birth to me and my mom is my sister because she never acted like a mom.

Maybe it's because her mom never acted like a mom because she never know how a mom should act because she never have one and now is a bad influence.

Or it's just the way everyone think we are sisters when they saw us outside and she just let them think that to screw with them. The worse part is thinking my dad either enable that behavior because he thought it was funny or he like it when women act half their age. But he is retarded so I think he just forgot my mom is not young anymore like she forgot how to age.

Is it the mind influencing the body or is it the body influencing the mind?

What matters the most is that you're happy & no bad ending happened at all.

 

[AnkaNix]

Well, some people use fiction to channel their Oedipus complex. Honestly, it's a bit creepy. We don't see mothers like that even in fiction; after all, it's our mothers who give birth to us (unless someone is born from a rock like Sun Wukong).

I still wish I could travel back two years in past and stop myself from reading those trash stories. People like that should get treatments.

Idk. I always think my grandma is the one who give birth to me and my mom is my sister because she never acted like a mom.

Maybe it's because her mom never acted like a mom because she never know how a mom should act because she never have one and now is a bad influence.

Or it's just the way everyone think we are sisters when they saw us outside and she just let them think that to screw with them. The worse part is thinking my dad either enable that behavior because he thought it was funny or he like it when women act half their age. But he is retarded so I think he just forgot my mom is not young anymore like she forgot how to age.

Is it the mind influencing the body or is it the body influencing the mind?

I wonder what kind of influence I will have on my child... Hopefully they don't pick up my bad habits. Such as procrastination.

 

[Sylver]

What's your fav example?

Hmm, hard to pick. But some examples from manga are classic shonen jump like Dragon Ball, or if we're using novels then Harry Potter and Pendragon come to mind.

 

[SouthernMaiden]

Hmm, hard to pick. But some examples from manga are classic shonen jump like Dragon Ball, or if we're using novels then Harry Potter and Pendragon come to mind.

Wow cant believe i never heard of pendragon. Slightly younger me would have loved that based on the wikipedia on it

 

[CinnaSloth]

my protagonist started wimpy, and a pushover. literally got her butt kicked a bunch.
I'm 60+ chapters deep and she's only barely getting a handle on her abilities/ responsibilities/ obligations/ anger, and she's still kind of a wimp. She trying, but she's still Herself.

My other character! He's.. normal. Just normal. A goddess keeps trying to make him cool and strong, but he's just normal. and dies. ....a lot.

 

[MFontana]

We all know that web novels, light novels, and LitRPGs are absolutely saturated with overpowered protagonists. Sometimes they start out weak, then become OP by the the end of the first chapter. Occasionally, it'll take a handful of chapters before the protag gets crazy strong.

Or my least favourite: When a protag starts out weak with humble origins, but it's revealed that wow, they're not nobody their parents were actually super duper special and oh wow they inherited that too. Why does a peasant have to have a secret noble lineage to be strong?

Personally, I love it when an MC starts out weak (pathetic even), but through their own efforts (and with some help) they're able to become stronger. Not the strongest (at least not early on).

A series that does it really well is Grimgar of Fantasy and Ash, the MC has a steady upwards trajectory (with a few significant setbacks), but it takes a long long time for them to even be considered notable among adventurers. The gap between them and the top parties is vast, but they still manage to be amazing and competent. It's a great balance.

How do ya'll prefer to write your MCs? OP from the get go? Weak, but quickly becomes OP? And how fast should it happen?

Personally, I'd say it all comes down to the execution and the focus of the narrative itself.
For some, it's completely fine for the protagonist to be overpowered, because of the inherent nature of the story's conflicts.
For example: Superman.
He's OP as hell, but it works fine for his story, because it isn't about whether he's strong enough, or powerful enough, but rather it is about the morality and ethics of his character. The question is never about whether he is strong enough to do whatever bullshit he is able to pull out of his ass to win the day in the end, and it isn't about whether he can grow stronger or not.
His story's conflicts are often about morality, and "Doing the right thing" which lets him be "as strong as he needs to be" without derailing the story.

When the series does feature questions, or concerns, about growing stronger (leveling up, or what have you), then there should definitely be a steady upward trajectory built into the narrative. The biggest issue with this that I've seen though, is "power-creep" since the threats the characters face also need to continue getting "stronger" as well to maintain the dramatic tension and sense of danger. Keep it up and you'll eventually end up with powers and abilities in the absurd ranges if you're not careful about your execution. Which really doesn't translate much into enjoyment (for me anyway). I much prefer when the characters start off "weaker" and have to "work at it" to gain anything substantial, yet those 'substantial' gains are never elevated to the absurd degree that some (most) shounen series tend to reach.

As for what I prefer for a main character(s), honestly, a mix of both, and there is one motto that I live by with regard to all of my own writing projects, as well as what I tend to look for in the fiction I'm reading, as far as what the characters in the story are capable of.
Special, but not Unique.
There is something that makes each, individual, character special in the story, but no single character is "unique" in this regard. There is no single character who can achieve everything they want to, without cost or effort, and most often, they need to work together in order to achieve their goals.
I build this into every TTRPG campaign I've run over the last twenty years, and the same holds true for the fiction that I write (and personally, the fiction that I enjoy the most).

When the characters are all distinct, and contribute meaningfully to the story and the plot (in their own way), then I tend to find a lot more enjoyment when I'm reading, or watching. For example; The X-Men; Fate/, etc etc.

 

[Naravelt]

Yeah, nobody knows what that is. Gundam? Is that the thing about robots?

It feels more like a story about teenagers being traumatized by war and politics, while the robots are just there to sell plastic models.

There was a 90s Gundam series where the protagonist was only thirteen and tried to save his mother. Then tragedy hit. He held it up and said, “This was my mother,” showing her severed head to the crowd. It’s insane that they made something like that for a show aimed at kids.

 

[Xanderx]

I’m not really a light novel reader like that, but I do read cultivation stories a lot, and my preference is a bit odd but I prefer when the protagonist goes from weak to strong, with no incredible background, no powerful parents and all of that. But I prefer when they start out weak and work their way up to being strong and undefeated, even if they go towards the evil direction, I still end up wanting them to end up as the winner tbh ?

 

[CharlesEBrown]

Yes. All of the above. Well-written. any of them can work. Poorly written, and all of them can be painfully tedious.