Unsure what Readers feel

[StoryTellingGhost]

Finally, my Story reached its first Major Storyline event. That being, Family Reunion.

After reading the latest comment on my last chapter.
"Cant tell who is talking. Its hard to read" even if my first few chapters have comments regarding the same, I fixed most of the issues in the following ones.

Though, it seems that this issue still remains. Tho, I am quite certain that I made it clear who is talking, I still find myself in confusion as to why my Chapter gains views and reads, but only a few people say it is "Hard to Read".

At this point, I give up at thinking of an answer.

Please, refrain from posting "Just write better" or suggest a different written style.
I've chosen this one and I will stick with it. Even if only a certain amount of people have an interest in reading it.

 

[CupcakeNinja]

Well then whats the point of this thread, tho? You dont want to change your writing style. To be honest its not even a hard problem to solve, just go, "blah blah blah" [insert name here] said

If people still whine about not being able to tell who is saying what, either they are being nitpicky cunts or are retarded motherfuckers. Either way you dont have to give them any consideration. If this was really a problem I gurantee you would have everyone and their mother lodging complaints.

 

[LordAstrea]

I would say it is possibly the lack of quotation marks that are typical when it comes to dialogue. Sometimes there are multiple people speaking without a new paragraph being formed. That is my guess when people say, "Cant tell who is talking."
That being said, you use the vertical bar (not sure if correct term) "|" to indicate some of these shifts, and I picked up on it rather quickly reading the chapter. There are also plenty of identifying factors, like honorifics ("Sir"), to tell us who is speaking without dialogue indicators.
I'm not going to suggest a different writing style, because I have read many many books, some that are published, which don't use the typical quotation marks and indicators. The Reapers Are the Angels is an example of a book that doesn't follow the paragraph/quotation rule all the time, and I thoroughly enjoyed that and had no issues.
The book I mentioned does use more dialogue indicators though, and then for the next lines it doesn't usually rely on them. Perhaps a new line for when a new person speaks could help.

 

[StoryTellingGhost]

Well then whats the point of this thread, tho? You dont want to change your writing style. To be honest its not even a hard problem to solve, just go, "blah blah blah" [insert name here] said

If people still whine about not being able to tell who is saying what, either they are being nitpicky cunts or are retarded motherfuckers. Either way you dont have to give them any consideration. If this was really a problem I gurantee you would have everyone and their mother lodging complaints.

That makes sense. The main point was if I was the ignorant one here.

I saw plenty of other books use this type of writing style.

I realized that said people are being nitpicky and/or just trying to piss me off after I posted this. So that's my bad. :D

I would say it is possibly the lack of quotation marks that are typical when it comes to dialogue. Sometimes there are multiple people speaking without a new paragraph being formed. That is my guess when people say, "Cant tell who is talking."
That being said, you use the vertical bar (not sure if correct term) "|" to indicate some of these shifts, and I picked up on it rather quickly reading the chapter. There are also plenty of identifying factors, like honorifics ("Sir"), to tell us who is speaking without dialogue indicators.
I'm not going to suggest a different writing style, because I have read many many books, some that are published, which don't use the typical quotation marks and indicators. The Reapers Are the Angels is an example of a book that doesn't follow the paragraph/quotation rule all the time, and I thoroughly enjoyed that and had no issues.
The book I mentioned does use more dialogue indicators though, and then for the next lines it doesn't usually rely on them. Perhaps a new line for when a new person speaks could help.

I appreciate the detailed response.

Since I started writing here, it was very clear to me that I had to use some sort of "split" between who is speaking to whom.

But it seems that some people just don't like it when someone does something "Unorthodox" in their eyes.

Thank you all kindly for answering.

 

[Valmond]

Finally, my Story reached its first Major Storyline event. That being, Family Reunion.

After reading the latest comment on my last chapter.
"Cant tell who is talking. Its hard to read" even if my first few chapters have comments regarding the same, I fixed most of the issues in the following ones.

Though, it seems that this issue still remains. Tho, I am quite certain that I made it clear who is talking, I still find myself in confusion as to why my Chapter gains views and reads, but only a few people say it is "Hard to Read".

At this point, I give up at thinking of an answer.

Please, refrain from posting "Just write better" or suggest a different written style.
I've chosen this one and I will stick with it. Even if only a certain amount of people have an interest in reading it.

There was a good advice I have been given a long time ago.

Someone once told me the same thing, and suggested that I separated dialogues from paragraphs. It was one of the better advice I had gotten. Which really did help to clarify who is speaking, and made the work cleaner to the view.

Another thing, which I picked up on my own. Is try to define the characters personality. Write them in a certain way, so when tags are not present. The style used to write will define who is speaking, or whose perspective the paragraphs are drawing from. There are many ways to do this. Though, it becomes easier if the characters can be identified based on how they are portrayed personality wise.

Now then, you are lacking quotation marks for dialogues. Then yeah...might wanna add those. However, if it involves monologues. Then these should reflect the personality of the character, in order to identify who is speaking.

 

[StoryTellingGhost]

There was a good advice I have been given a long time ago.

Someone once told me the same thing, and suggested that I separated dialogues from paragraphs. It was one of the better advice I had gotten. Which really did help to clarify who is speaking, and made the work cleaner to the view.

Another thing, which I picked up on my own. Is try to define the characters personality. Write them in a certain way, so when tags are not present. The style used to write will define who is speaking, or whose perspective the paragraphs are drawing from. There are many ways to do this. Though, it becomes easier if the characters can be identified based on how they are portrayed personality wise.

Now then, you are lacking quotation marks for dialogues. Then yeah...might wanna add those. However, if it involves monologues. Then these should reflect the personality of the character, in order to ifentify who is speaking.

For those who have followed my story since day 1. It should be clear how the story is written and how to differentiate who is talking.

As it is the first major event and quite a few new characters have been introduced, it will take some time for readers to remember how each of them talks. But I get the point.

Thank you for replying, and the advice.

 

[Valmond]

For those who have followed my story since day 1. It should be clear how the story is written and how to differentiate who is talking.

As it is the first major event and quite a few new characters have been introduced, it will take some time for readers to remember how each of them talks. But I get the point.

Thank you for replying, and the advice.

Yeah, since it is the first major event. Give it time. Thing is from what I noticed. You will know you have hit your base somewhere around the midpoint of a book. By that time, readers are almost certainly there to stay. There will also be little to no complaints. I suppose you can say, the first half of a book is the weed puller point. The second half, are those that are flourishing. You’ll get quite a bit of negativity in the first half, so I wouldn’t recommend focusing too much on it.

Everyone has a preference. You can try to bring in new faces, but it will make life a lot easier if you continue to stick to the base you are trying to appeal towards. In time, others should follow.

 

[StoryTellingGhost]

Yeah, since it is the first major event. Give it time. Thing is from what I noticed. You will know you have hit your base somewhere around the midpoint of a book. By that time, readers are almost certainly there to stay. There will also be little to no complaints. I suppose you can say, the first half of a book is the weed puller point. The second half, are those that are flourishing. You’ll get quite a bit of negativity in the first half, so I wouldn’t recommend focusing too much on it.

Everyone has a preference. You can try to bring in new faces, but it will make life a lot easier if you continue to stick to the base you are trying to appeal towards. In time, others should follow.

Sad to say, I did what I shouldn't have done. Focus on the ones that say negative stuff, rather than the ones that actually love the story and wait with anticipation for the next Chapter.

It was a waste of time, thankfully. This Forum saved me from a few pitfalls. Thanks, everyone!

 

[moeforsushi]

That makes sense. The main point was if I was the ignorant one here.

I saw plenty of other books use this type of writing style.

I realized that said people are being nitpicky and/or just trying to piss me off after I posted this. So that's my bad. :D

I appreciate the detailed response.

Since I started writing here, it was very clear to me that I had to use some sort of "split" between who is speaking to whom.

But it seems that some people just don't like it when someone does something "Unorthodox" in their eyes.

Thank you all kindly for answering.

- Thanks Miss, please relax. I am not that scary. | Sir, you're the exact opposite of that. | Oh...

I will be honest, it is confusing. How many people are talking here? You used "-" at the begging, so my first assumption would be one, but then it doesn't make sense.

If it is a conversation between two people, then:

- Thanks Miss, please relax. I am not that scary.

- Sir, you're the exact opposite of that.

- Oh..,

would be a more natural way to write it, no?

I don't want to tell you that your writing style is bad, but I don't know why you would be adamant about using "|". In my opinion, it doesn't accomplish anything other than making it hard to read.

Also, it is the first time I see this way of writing.

 

[Valmond]

Sad to say, I did what I shouldn't have done. Focus on the ones that say negative stuff, rather than the ones that actually love the story and wait with anticipation for the next Chapter.

It was a waste of time, thankfully. This Forum saved me from a few pitfalls. Thanks, everyone!

Yeah, I think we all pretty much make this mistake at first. Hell, I did so when starting off as well. It is a learning experience. Thing is, people have such a vast difference of opinion, that it becomes impossible to please them all. In reality, just focus your time on improving, and finding that base.

You’ll eventually get readers that will spearhead their way through. I should know, I had someone once read my trilogy in three days. Back then it was about 200k words. More recently, I had a few read through my first and second book in a matter of two or three days. Those two together are about 313k words. Now they are waiting for the rerelease of the final book in the trilogy. This eventually lead to some others checking out my other works.

So, don‘t lose heart. Just keep at it, and continuously try to do better for yourself. If you improve your abilities, then more will be likely to stay and keep reading.

 

[RepresentingCaution]

a few people say it is "Hard to Read"

A few people are probably stupid or just don't enjoy the writing style. There are a few big-name authors I find hard to read because they just put me to sleep.

 

[Reisinling]

Listen new face, (inhales cigarette smoke), readers... (exhales) readers don't feel.
They are beasts. They only consume. Ever hungry. You feed them, you might prosper. You don't? Well, they might search for another way of "entertainment". They might watch original content, a very private story of author being kept in a cage, to continue writing, and writing, and writing...

well, you know the drill. NOW WRITE

 

[KiraMinoru]

A few people are probably stupid or just don't enjoy the writing style. There are a few big-name authors I find hard to read because they just put me to sleep.

Asking someone to use quotation marks for dialogue isn't the readers being stupid. It is because it is genuinely a pain in the ass to read without some sort of bare minimum standard practice to follow. Half the time you don't even know who is speaking in this powerpoint looking ass dialogue.

I tried reading it and it makes me feel nauseous without quotation marks. If you insist on using any sort of dashes or lines(|) for dialogue, at least use the Japanese quotation marks『Insert dialogue here.』At least readers are used to this because it is commonly seen in Japanese novels and is much more distinct than | Insert dialogue here. | The way the Japanese lines curve to make it distinct what is start and finish of a dialogue line is far superior to the directionless |.

 

[StoryTellingGhost]

Asking someone to use quotation marks for dialogue isn't the readers being stupid. It is because it is genuinely a pain in the ass to read without some sort of bare minimum standard practice to follow. Half the time you don't even know who is speaking in this powerpoint looking ass dialogue.

I tried reading it and it makes me feel nauseous without quotation marks. If you insist on using any sort of dashes or lines(|) for dialogue, at least use the Japanese quotation marks『Insert dialogue here.』At least readers are used to this because it is commonly seen in Japanese novels and is much more distinct than | Insert dialogue here. | The way the Japanese lines curve to make it distinct what is start and finish of a dialogue line is far superior to the directionless |.

I don't even use "|" for dialogue. I use "-" to mark dialogues and I use "|" to mark the inner voice of the MC.

If it makes people nauseous then they simply shouldn't read it. It's their own best that way.

Since I started I felt that " " forces a break in reading so that the Narrator or the MC can say something.
It is way more natural in the way it is now, most readers should be accustomed to it by Chapter 3 or 4. If not, they don't have to force themselves to read it and then comment "It's hard to read".

Asking someone to use quotation marks for dialogue isn't the readers being stupid. It is because it is genuinely a pain in the ass to read without some sort of bare minimum standard practice to follow. Half the time you don't even know who is speaking in this powerpoint looking ass dialogue.

I tried reading it and it makes me feel nauseous without quotation marks. If you insist on using any sort of dashes or lines(|) for dialogue, at least use the Japanese quotation marks『Insert dialogue here.』At least readers are used to this because it is commonly seen in Japanese novels and is much more distinct than | Insert dialogue here. | The way the Japanese lines curve to make it distinct what is start and finish of a dialogue line is far superior to the directionless |.

If you just jumped in at the last Chapter, you really have no idea who the characters are and their style of talking.

Judging from what you wrote in the last paragraph, that seems to be the case. It is clear from the first, rather second, Chapter that there is a " sort of bare minimum standard practice to follow"

Powerpoint? Not sure what you mean by that. But I've heard it a couple of times. You don't need to like it.

A few people are probably stupid or just don't enjoy the writing style. There are a few big-name authors I find hard to read because they just put me to sleep.

That is the case, so it seems.

It was weird to me how some people say it is good and they'll keep reading it(Poll on my last chapter). While a one or two, say the opposite.

Same as someone in this thread, don't want to point fingers at anyone. But just saying that it is bad just because you have zero understanding and jumped the train at Chapter 10, doesn't mean you can just say "it's a pain in the ass to read" or "Stupid Powerpoint-looking dialogue".

Inhales

This feels more like a rant, rather than a question thread.

 

[KiraMinoru]

Using - for dialogue is worse than using lines. The quotation mark was created for a reason. It denotes both the opening and closing, a dash does not achieve that. Knowing where to start and where to end is important. If you don’t know where to start and where to end, you just get lost in what looks like a bunch of noise. Using a plain line to try and cut the dialogue off mid speech to change to a thought is just plain confusing to any reader and will definitely turn a lot of people off from even considering trying to read your story.

Powerpoint? Not sure what you mean by that. But I've heard it a couple of times. You don't need to like it.

I say PowerPoint because it literally looks like slides on a cluttered PowerPoint presentation rather than dialogue in a story. Spacing exists for a reason, this is especially the case for webnovels. When people see clustered blocks of text without spaces it just becomes a chore to keep track of where you are when reading digitally. There is a big difference between physical printed publications and digital ones.

Inhales

This feels more like a rant, rather than a question thread.

The title of your thread is “unsure what readers feel.” I’m being blunt as I don’t like beating around the bush, but you’re simply being told how someone who tried to read it felt after trying to read a bit of it. Then you’re getting irritated because someone is telling you their honest reaction that isn’t sugar coated bullshit.

 

[StoryTellingGhost]

Using - for dialogue is worse than using lines. The quotation mark was created for a reason. It denotes both the opening and closing, a dash does not achieve that. Knowing where to start and where to end is important. If you don’t know where to start of where to end, you just get lost in what looks like a bunch of noise. Using a line to try and cut the dialogue off mid speech to change to athought is just plain confusing to any reader and will definitely turn a lot of people off from even considering trying to read your story.


I say PowerPoint because it literally looks like slides on a cluttered PowerPoint presentation rather than dialogue in a story. Spacing exists for a reason, this is especially the case for webnovels. When people see clustered blocks of text without spaces it just becomes a chore to keep track of where you are when reading digitally. There is a big difference between physical printed publications and digital ones.

As said before, I am quite sure you jumped onto Chapter 10 and of course, you have no idea what "|" means and what it actually is there for.

So far, only 2 or 3 people have said that it is "Hard to read" even though the dialogue is blatantly obvious and the inner voice of the MC is also clearly determined.

If it looks like a Powerpoint presentation... then I got no words for your level of respect for my Work.
Sadly, you've only pointed out negative and matters that are clearly defined in the Story. It seems to me you just don't like it when people try something new, no?

Also, don't turn this into a rant thread. I meant to ask serious opinions and not hate speech from a person that jumps onto the last chapter and bashes together their confusion on a thread from the Author.

 

[KiraMinoru]

As said before, I am quite sure you jumped onto Chapter 10 and of course, you have no idea what "|" means and what it actually is there for.

So far, only 2 or 3 people have said that it is "Hard to read" even though the dialogue is blatantly obvious and the inner voice of the MC is also clearly determined.

If it looks like a Powerpoint presentation... then I got no words for your level of respect for my Work.
Sadly, you've only pointed out negative and matters that are clearly defined in the Story. It seems to me you just don't like it when people try something new, no?

Also, don't turn this into a rant thread. I meant to ask serious opinions and not hate speech from a person that jumps onto the last chapter and bashes together their confusion on a thread from the Author.

I’m simply telling you that I can see why the two comments I saw on your fiction from people who have pointed out the the quotation marks and why it’s hard to read. They are not stupid for pointing it out at all. I’m not saying trying different things is bad, but you don’t seem to realize most readers don’t want to hurt your feelings. People take shit too personally these days after all.

When you want to try something different you have to realize you open yourself up to people critiquing what you’re doing differently. Telling you it looks like what you will see on a PowerPoint presentation is genuine critique of how you’ve decided to layout your work, not an attack on your writing.

 

[StoryTellingGhost]

I’m simply telling you that I can see why the two comments I saw on your fiction from people who have pointed out the the quotation marks and why it’s hard to read. They are not stupid for pointing it out at all. I’m not saying trying different things is bad, but you don’t seem to realize most readers don’t want to hurt your feelings. People take shit too personally these days after all.

When you want to try something different you have to realize you open yourself up to people critiquing what you’re doing differently. Telling you it looks like what you will see on a PowerPoint presentation is genuine critique of how you’ve decided to layout your work, not an attack on your writing.

One is critique... and one is blatantly being ignorant of the obvious.

I really don't want to drag this one out.

Some people, like yourself, want to live in their own bubble, ignorant of their surrounding and the reality facing them. I personally let them be, in their own world, playing with their own toys.

 

[KiraMinoru]

Some people want to live in their own bubble, ignorant of their surrounding and the reality facing them.

Maybe you’ll see the irony of your own words one day. Anyway, good luck with your writing. No hard feelings. But if you ask me, people who’ve just started posting who haven’t been through the hellfire that is Amazon and RoyalRoad have yet to see anything. ScribbleHub is honestly the bubble and safe haven.

 

[StoryTellingGhost]

Maybe you’ll see the irony of your own words one day. Anyway, good luck with your writing. No hard feelings. But if you ask me, people who’ve just started posting who haven’t been through the hellfire that is Amazon and RoyalRoad have yet to see anything. ScribbleHub is honestly the bubble and safe haven.

I didn't bother to go onto any of them because I knew the "hellfire" they are.

No hard feelings as well, take care and good luck with your own writing as well.