Suspension of disbelief: Plothole edition

[Racosharko]

So in film, a general rule of thumb is that you get one free pass per film for a plot hole, or an "it just works" movie magic moment.

Two is pushing it, but never three.

Usually this happened because it makes a better story, and by being a better story the audience either not notice or forgive it.

How do you think it applies to books and web novels?

Once per book? Once per act? Never

One per chapter? Per arc?

 

[GlassRose]

I think that it's too complicated to be summed up like that, it very much depends on the genre, the audience, the egregiousness of the hole and where it occurs, etc. And you shouldn't make the assumption that you'll get a free pass when actually making the thing either, that's lazy writing and produces a lower-quality product.

And that goes for movies too.

 

[Echimera]

I'd vehemently disagree that 'it makes for a better story' is a legit excuse for having glaring contradictions in your story, and that's independent of the medium.


I'll be with everyone else defending a story when people overreact and call it a plothole when something that can be reasonably expected to happen isn't shown on screen or talked about (or on the page, in case of written media).
Like, I don't have to see the protagonist updating their friends on where they think the bad guys are in a story set in modern day to accept that these friends can show up just in time to save the day.
In short: Stuff happening off screen is not a plot hole, unless it explicitly contradics something that's been set up.
Maybe that's where the 'it makes for a better story' comes from? The better pacing you can get when not interrupting the story for phone calls to keep the cavalry up to date on where they'll have to show up in the end all the time.


What I can't excuse is when the story explicitly very clearly contradicts something that's been set up before.
Like, to stay with the example, it's established that there is no physical way for the friends to get to the scene only for them to show up anyway.
If you can't resolve your story without having physics breaking plot holes or pulling a deus ex machina, you need to get back and tweak the whole thing.
Also, if it's a plot twist, properly resolve the whole thing, don't just leave it there to look like a plot hole.


Or characters clearly acting out of character. I don't expect characters to act entirely logical, that would make a story boring as everyone would be a machine. But I expect characters to act in accordance with their established goals, world view, relationships and the information they have at the time.
If you need a character to act counter to their interests or in opposition to their side, at least put in the effort to set up that they have faulty information, instead of giving them a case of short term insanity (or even long term, if you want them to switch sides but don't actually put int he effort to make it believable).


Don't get me wrong, I can often overlook even bad plot holes when I'm having fun, but that doesn't mean that the story wouldn't be better if the creator put in the extra work to fix the plot hole(s).
I simply can't think of any legit plot hole that actually makes a story better, nor of any story that isn't made worse by having glaring plot holes in it.

 

[DireBadger]

at least in Gamelit, a glaring plot hole is actually just a plot complication. (Let's find out what cheat they used!)
There's a reason I enjoy reader feedback. Heck, some of my best plot twists have come from my reader commentary. (usually without their knowledge)

 

[CharlesEBrown]

at least in Gamelit, a glaring plot hole is actually just a plot complication. (Let's find out what cheat they used!)
There's a reason I enjoy reader feedback. Heck, some of my best plot twists have come from my reader commentary. (usually without their knowledge)

So far, in my fiction, the only plot twist I've had a reader suggest had already been planned about a month earlier...
Now, in Role Playing Games, twice now I've had players suggest things that made more sense than what I had planned and their guesses became canon...

 

[Racosharko]

I just think this is funny.

 

[DireBadger]

So far, in my fiction, the only plot twist I've had a reader suggest had already been planned about a month earlier...
Now, in Role Playing Games, twice now I've had players suggest things that made more sense than what I had planned and their guesses became canon...

I am weird. In my case, I introduced the Mayor, and one of my readers suggested that she show her fanny in a pair of spanx and some Jimmy Choos.

Three hours later I re-wrote the twist ending so that the protagonist's best friend 'big gay Jim' (Who isn't big, isn't gay, and isn't actually named Jim) was the secret supervillain, and was the Mayor's subby little B**** boy because he liked it when she spanked him, and he was doing the scary supervillain gig to help her get re-elected.

I never said it was direct :)

 

[soupsabaw]

Personally, in order to be considered a "masterpiece," I don't think any piece of media should have a plothole. Even if something does, that doesn't necessarily mean that it's a bad piece of media. We're humans; we overlook things sometimes and make mistakes, but we can still be good and create great things. The best "plotholes" I think are ones that allow the audience to create some theories on their own, so it leans more toward an explorable question that people can apply their own creativity rather than being a straight up plot hole. I guess it just depends on the severity of the plot hole for me. If it's something bluntly obvious, it can turn many others away; however, if it's something that took some digging and thinking to figure out, it could be fun.

 

[beast_regards]

It reminds me of the video made by some pedantic Youtuber which insisted that the plot holes don't matter by providing the examples of the cuts, scene transition, and generally, events happening off screen.

However, after listening (or rather reading) to the Internet discussion on the certain forums, most of the plot holes could be explained as a narrative causality.

A specific sequence of events which need to happen in order for the plot to happen.

If only the self-insert character could appear and break it....

The popular source of fan-fiction material since time immemorial, it seems.