How much coincidence is too much coincidence?

[ThisAdamGuy]

How tolerant are you to stories progressing via random coincidence?

I just tried to read a Pokemon-style litrpg called Gigabeasts, and had to give up before chapter three because there were just too many coincidences happening back to back. The main character inherits a farm from his dad that just so happens to exist in the Gigabeast dimension? Fine. He just so happens to meet and immediately bond with the perfect (and perfectly mascot-worthy) Gigabeast less than two minutes after arriving? Fine. Another Gigabeast just so happens to come out of nowhere a minute later to serve as a tutorial fight? Sure. A random woman also just so happens to be trespassing on his property at that exact moment (in the middle of the night) to walk him through how Gigabeast battles work? Ehhh... And that woman just so happens to be a total bombshell who (let me check real quick) yep, ends up being the romantic interest? Aaand my suspension of disbelief just snapped.

So yeah, I guess that's where the line gets drawn for me. To be more exact, I think it gets to be too much when coincidence both initiates and resolves a conflict. I'm more tolerant when a conflict is initiated by random coincidence, but the plot needs to be directly impacted by the characters' actions at some point. If they accidentally themselves into a problem and then deus ex machina themselves out, I probably won't want to keep reading.

 

[Yodo]

For me, it gets iffy with more than one coincidence. I think one of the things that characterizes most fantasy stories is a single "point of divergence" where the setting changes from what the reader expects.
This is relative of course, fan fictions are generally written for people that already know the original setting, so they get a new "point of divergence". And the same could be said for specific genres, that they already set the expectations of the reader - audience is key.

Coincidences can also often be explained/retconned, but this does require work from the authors side with at least a bit of foreshadowing imo.

 

[vzymmer]

Coincidences are only great if it can only be noticed in hindsight or at a present situation.

It kinda gets annoying if repeated too much and spotted too easily though.

Cause the reader are gonna think cliché or plot armor or some other things like that.

I also agree with the thing above about foreshadowing.

 

[Deleted member 166465]

Go crazy, as long as the character is cool no one cares... look at batman, fucking guy is a walking plot armor.
Everyone loves him.

 

[BearlyAlive]

It's a "pokemon-style" story, just do it tongue-in-cheek and break the 4th wall for a bit and throw a few jabs at the pkmn start. As long as you break the mold shortly after that, it's fine.

 

[Jerynboe]

As a rule of thumb I feel like coincidences should cause or initiate problems, not solve them. There are exceptions, for example if fate or luck manipulation are in play somehow, but then it’s magic solving the problem.

It’s a lot better if the coincidences are somehow justified or at least tied together. Like if romantic interest bombshell tutorial girl was actually hunting for the mascot partner in the middle of the night near this special farm, and is a little bit annoyed that some complete noob yoinked it without even knowing what the fuck he’s doing. She proceeds to educate him mostly so that he doesn’t waste his lottery ticket level luck.

Alternatively, she tries to battle him to take his monster as a wager, and when she loses because it’s ridiculously op or super in sync with him or whatever, she has to help him out or becomes a stalker or what have you. Something like that. Then it’s all one BIG coincidence that kicked off the whole plot.

 

[JayMark]

How tolerant are you to stories progressing via random coincidence?

I just tried to read a Pokemon-style litrpg called Gigabeasts, and had to give up before chapter three because there were just too many coincidences happening back to back. The main character inherits a farm from his dad that just so happens to exist in the Gigabeast dimension? Fine. He just so happens to meet and immediately bond with the perfect (and perfectly mascot-worthy) Gigabeast less than two minutes after arriving? Fine. Another Gigabeast just so happens to come out of nowhere a minute later to serve as a tutorial fight? Sure. A random woman also just so happens to be trespassing on his property at that exact moment (in the middle of the night) to walk him through how Gigabeast battles work? Ehhh... And that woman just so happens to be a total bombshell who (let me check real quick) yep, ends up being the romantic interest? Aaand my suspension of disbelief just snapped.

So yeah, I guess that's where the line gets drawn for me. To be more exact, I think it gets to be too much when coincidence both initiates and resolves a conflict. I'm more tolerant when a conflict is initiated by random coincidence, but the plot needs to be directly impacted by the characters' actions at some point. If they accidentally themselves into a problem and then deus ex machina themselves out, I probably won't want to keep reading.

You didn't make it to the part where the lawyer from Nintendo visits the farm with DMCA takedown notice for the entire world. That's the best part. Nintendo now owns both 'coincidence' and 'deus ex machina' in collaboration with some with some other corporations.

 

[Tempokai]

Too much coincidence fails when readers start to notice. If you think they'll notice, don't do it.

 

[NotaNuffian]

How tolerant are you to stories progressing via random coincidence?

I just tried to read a Pokemon-style litrpg called Gigabeasts, and had to give up before chapter three because there were just too many coincidences happening back to back. The main character inherits a farm from his dad that just so happens to exist in the Gigabeast dimension? Fine. He just so happens to meet and immediately bond with the perfect (and perfectly mascot-worthy) Gigabeast less than two minutes after arriving? Fine. Another Gigabeast just so happens to come out of nowhere a minute later to serve as a tutorial fight? Sure. A random woman also just so happens to be trespassing on his property at that exact moment (in the middle of the night) to walk him through how Gigabeast battles work? Ehhh... And that woman just so happens to be a total bombshell who (let me check real quick) yep, ends up being the romantic interest? Aaand my suspension of disbelief just snapped.

So yeah, I guess that's where the line gets drawn for me. To be more exact, I think it gets to be too much when coincidence both initiates and resolves a conflict. I'm more tolerant when a conflict is initiated by random coincidence, but the plot needs to be directly impacted by the characters' actions at some point. If they accidentally themselves into a problem and then deus ex machina themselves out, I probably won't want to keep reading.

Personally, once or twice in a short span of time is a-ok. Sometimes life is such. Too many times however and it is probably a scam in action.

Or at least try to justify the coincidence such as having the bombshell trespass with a proper reason like "she's a fan of both Gigabeast and commiting crime"

Your example is the standard hackneyed JP plot... which makes sense it is a bad pokemon fic

 

[Deleted member 166465]

As a rule of thumb I feel like coincidences should cause or initiate problems, not solve them. There are exceptions, for example if fate or luck manipulation are in play somehow, but then it’s magic solving the problem.

It’s a lot better if the coincidences are somehow justified or at least tied together. Like if romantic interest bombshell tutorial girl was actually hunting for the mascot partner in the middle of the night near this special farm, and is a little bit annoyed that some complete noob yoinked it without even knowing what the fuck he’s doing. She proceeds to educate him mostly so that he doesn’t waste his lottery ticket level luck.

Alternatively, she tries to battle him to take his monster as a wager, and when she loses because it’s ridiculously op or super in sync with him or whatever, she has to help him out or becomes a stalker or what have you. Something like that. Then it’s all one BIG coincidence that kicked off the whole plot.

Unless you are batman.

Too much coincidence fails when readers start to notice. If you think they'll notice, don't do it.

Unless is a story about batman.

Personally, once or twice in a short span of time is a-ok. Sometimes life is such. Too many times however and it is probably a scam in action.

Or at least try to justify the coincidence such as having the bombshell trespass with a proper reason like "she's a fan of both Gigabeast and commiting crime"

Your example is the standard hackneyed JP plot... which makes sense it is a bad pokemon fic

I really didnt read your answer, but since I am giving "Batman" to everyone I tough it would be discrimination to not give you a batman so... Yeah.
BATMAN: "pow" "blam" Kboom"

 

[ThisAdamGuy]

You didn't make it to the part where the lawyer from Nintendo visits the farm with DMCA takedown notice for the entire world.

I think it's more likely that they'd be Marvel's lawyers since the Gigabeast the MC bonds with is literally just Jeff the Landshark.

 

[Arkus86]

Once is an accident. Twice is a coincidence. Three times - a pattern.

 

[xedale]

Unless you are batman.

Batman should have a number of positive event generators running in the background, so.

 

[Deleted member 166465]

Batman should have a number of positive event generators running in the background, so.

No need. He is batman.

 

[xedale]

No need. He is batman.

He isn't a metahuman like other superheroes, "I'm Batman" is just short for "I'm batshit crazy man". Insanity and money being his only superpowers, Bruce needs any advantage he can get out of them.

 

[Deleted member 166465]

He isn't a metahuman like other superheroes, "I'm Batman" is just short for "I'm batshit crazy man". Insanity and money being his only superpowers, Bruce needs any advantage he can get out of them.

No no no. He has the most awesome and omnipotent of all super powers. PLOT ARMOR GO!
Also he is Batman, Bruce wayne is just his alter ego, a mask.

 

[CharlesEBrown]

No no no. He has the most awesome and omnipotent of all super powers. PLOT ARMOR GO!
Also he is Batman, Bruce wayne is just his alter ego, a mask.

Apparently, (per someone who claimed to be an insider but I never verified it) this is no longer in the "DC Writer's Bible," but until about 2005 it did include a line close to, if not exactly this: "Batman is the character, Bruce Wayne is just a mask he wears. No, he is not insane."

Back on topic: If the coincidence is well-written and handled competently, I won't notice it until well after the fact.
This sounds like the writer was just rushing through the story and considered coincidence was the only thing that could drive the plot forward as he or she needed it.

 

[MasterY001]

Elim Garak once said, "I believe in coincidences. Coincidences happen every day. But I don't trust coincidences."

In terms of writing, deus ex machina (which literally translates to, "god out of a machine/scheme," "scheme" works better here imo) is one of the plot devices which can have a huge payout but only if used in moderation. In the end, sometimes things have to just "happen" to spark a story or keep it rolling.

But the amazing thing about fiction is that everything can be explained and should. No explanation results in a "coincidence." When an explanation is irrelevant to the main story, that's when deus ex machina is alright to use. While one person here really hates Batman, the most critically acclaimed superhero movie is still "The Dark Knight." That great film wouldn't even happen without the Joker, a villain with no explanation who just "does things," a great use of deus ex machina to create one of the most iconic villains in superhero culture.

Also, very rarely is fanfiction ever quality literature. In my opinion, a good fanfiction must build off the source material, not just use it as an excuse to bypass creativity.

 

[Supperset]

I hate too many coincidences that have no other meaning than just to increase or decrease the 'power' of the main characters and serves no other other fact thereafter (basically deus ex machina) but I am also a patient reader so I try to read atleast a dozen chapters before dropping a novel and when a novel click I get obsessed over it to read it to completion. It's kinda of an OCD at this point. I don't review that often when I read an original novel unless it's someone I know.

Currently I am reading Advent of the Three Calamities by Entrail_JI and it's damm good at foreshadowing and perspective manipulation.

Spoiler

Currently I think the name Inverted Sky or Invert the Sky is a literal goal and not a name

It's also fun sometime if those coincidences mean something and not become just steps or plot pushing elements.

 

[OniKaniki]

what about you thought it was a coincidence, but it was actually not? what if it was a throughout plan of someone else who intentionally make it that way?
What if your whole life, your whole adventure was a plan of some unknown existence? that you are just follow a script of somebody?
will it still be call as coincidence?
i read a novel where at a certain point, this dude antagonist take out a list and read his entire life in front of MC, make him almost losing control lol