Gay Characters in Fiction

[JordanIda]

Orrrrr consider that gay characters can exist even without a specific reason, just like the heteros can?

And consider that there's a lot more to partnerships than fucking?

Exactly! Ordinary life! My books have gay people, but they're not caricatures. They're just ordinary people. And why harp gratuitously on mundane biology? Only what serves the story.

(But as others have pointed out, sex sells, and the readers want mundane biology, and there's the rub.)

 

[Cookiez_N_Potionz]

Great topic

 

[Rezcore]

If the character is gay, and that's it, they're still productive characters that are also gay, then cool. But when their preference for whom they sleep with is most of their personality and presentation, it's fucking annoying. We get it, you're gay, what else can you do that's actually fucking useful to the narrative?

 

[CharlesEBrown]

Just wondering what, in your opinion, makes a gay character work in a piece of fiction, and what makes the writing not work as a work of art? Give me your thoughts and opinions.

Gay characters "work" when they make sense in the story.
In most of my stories, since the 80s, there has been at last one gay or bi character - in general just because that reflected the real world as I experienced it.
They "fail" in a piece of fiction if being gay is their most important trait, the only thing that defines them, rather than being part of who they are.

The writing is always a work of art - it just isn't always a good one and can be seen as an annoyingly preachy one if it seems to glorify gay relationships and denigrate traditional ones or makes the character just a bit too flamboyant and stereotypical (I remember comments from the first run of the TV series "Will and Grace" from LGBTQ people who said "After two episodes, we're pretty sure the actor playing Will is not gay, and really wish he were, while we also suspect the one playing Jack is not gay and doesn't even know anyone who is, just tries to be over the top on every gay stereotype.").

A story I wrote in the mid 90s had one of my favorite character interactions. Two superheroes, one a Batman-like lesbian (before the modern take on Batwoman came out ... literally and figuratively ... by almost a year IIRC) who is also a doctor and a skater, and who met the other character, a British "ladies' man" with powers very similar to The Thing except he can turn them on and off, when he made his costume. He's never seen her out of costume and sees her skating a few days before Christmas.
He stops to admire her - she had qualified for the Olympics when her parents' deaths made her give up those dreams and go into medicine, but never stopped practicing to stay in shape - and hit on her when she's done.
"I'm sure your very charming, and not bad looking," Susan replied, "But... well, I'm a lesbian..."
"Oh!" Nate replied, flushing slightly. "I... I'm so sorry..."
"Don't be - I rather enjoy it. Well, this has been a nice chat, but I have to get to work. Good meeting you Nathan, and Merry Christmas."
"Oh, I rather doubt that," he replied, a slight twinkle in his eye.
"Oh? Why is that?" she paused packing up her things to ask.
"Because I'm Jewish!"
"Ah! Oh... I'm so sorry..."
"Don't be - I rather enjoy it. And a good day to you, ma'am."

 

[Robert.Hillmyre]

Just wondering what, in your opinion, makes a gay character work in a piece of fiction, and what makes the writing not work as a work of art? Give me your thoughts and opinions.

I write a series where almost everyone is sapphic, and for me, it boils down to two things: It works when the character's orientation is 'baked in' rather than 'added on.' For example if in my work a Queen, shows her love for women should affect how she leads, who she trusts, and how she sees power. It works when the intimacy feels like a natural part of the world’s 'vibe' rather than a side-quest. It doesn't work when a character is 'The Gay One' and has no other personality traits.

 

[Peagreene]

I'm interested if people have examples of characters whose only personality trait is their queerness, as that seems to be the consensus of what we don't want to see. Conversely, what are some good examples of well-rounded queer characters?

 

[Fisher0001]

I'm interested if people have examples of characters whose only personality trait is their queerness, as that seems to be the consensus of what we don't want to see. Conversely, what are some good examples of well-rounded queer characters?

I mean, there's Disney Pixar movies released in the last few years, which had everything revolve around the characters' queerness and are forgettable. The fact I can't name a single one but know they exist should tell you something about the movies. Then, for good gay fiction, the best I saw was Brokeback Mountain, I think it's called, but it's a gay cowboy movie set in Montana in the early 2000s. It's largely seen as a classic movie.

 

[CharlesEBrown]

Well, some of the first, and (at least judging by the few openly gay people I personally know offline) best depictions I've seen were in the work of Mercedes Lackey (The Last Herald-Mage, etc.).
From television, one of the best (played by Eric McCormack, an actor who, IIRC, had a wife and daughter going into the show and a second daughter before it was cancelled the first time) was Will of Will and Grace - and one of the worst (who, ironically, at least according to a few people who claimed to know him personally, was playing a seriously exaggerated version of himself) was the guy who played Jack on the same show - but he's an actor (Sean Hayes) who disappears into his roles, unlike McCormack who just takes and makes them his own.

 

[Peagreene]

I mean, there's Disney Pixar movies released in the last few years, which had everything revolve around the characters' queerness and are forgettable.

Queerness in a Disney film? They notoriously only include brief mentions of queerness that can easily be cut out so the films can be distributed in China.

Brokeback Mountain is excellent.

 

[DireBadger]

good point. I have nonstandard sexuality characters in my books, but since I am not writing sex books, it really doesn't MATTER. people are people, and generally, what they do inthe bedroom only matters for certain genres.

 

[Sylver]

Just wondering what, in your opinion, makes a gay character work in a piece of fiction, and what makes the writing not work as a work of art? Give me your thoughts and opinions.

What makes a gay character work is when being gay does not encompass nor describe who they are. Someone's sexual preference should not be their complete identity, but rather attribute towards it as a part of who they are.

What makes a gay character not work in fiction is when their sexual preference is all that they can offer. I don't want or need them to be driven by stereotypes, people have lives, hobbies, interests, and goals outside of their dating life.

Writing a gay character is the same as writing any character. Write someone's interests, habits, give them a role to play, and make their gender/interest be something on the side, like a complimentary attribute. Unless their role is to challenge the notion of their preference, like a gay character who has to hide their sexuality from others in fear of repercussions, stuff like that can be the exception. But even then, they should offer more as a character than being gay. Just my two cents

 

[Fisher0001]

What makes a gay character work is when being gay does not encompass nor describe who they are. Someone's sexual preference should not be their complete identity, but rather attribute towards it as a part of who they are.

What makes a gay character not work in fiction is when their sexual preference is all that they can offer. I don't want or need them to be driven by stereotypes, people have lives, hobbies, interests, and goals outside of their dating life.

Writing a gay character is the same as writing any character. Write someone's interests, habits, give them a role to play, and make their gender/interest be something on the side, like a complimentary attribute. Unless their role is to challenge the notion of their preference, like a gay character who has to hide their sexuality from others in fear of repercussions, stuff like that can be the exception. But even then, they should offer more as a character than being gay. Just my two cents

I agree with this. Gay people are just people at the end of the day. We have our flaws, beliefs, and experiences like everyone else. In fact, with some gay people like me, people would never know unless they told them. In fact, most of my real-life friends don't know I'm gay. At the end of the day, people just want a good story. People want to be entertained and to forget about their lives for a few minutes and get lost in a different world with new characters.

 

[TinaMigarlo]

True story. I was (over?) writing a big investigation novel. Anyways, I always like to turn a trope on its head when I can. Now then, in absolutely *any* two buddies investigating movie, there just HAS to be the strip club. There's always a stripper, who just *happens* to have all the perfect information, and is willing to drop it on them. Honestly, why don't they just give strippers guns and badges, let them solve murders. They already know everything, right.

Okay. In the course of their legwork, they have to go to the gay dance club. Then I got mileage out of it, because it seemed to be "working". So I made the gay dance club a little bit of a recurring theme for a small patch in the novel. If there's an official gay "board of good taste" I have to run it past, to get "certified"... let me know.

 

[seavmun88]

It's the same as any other romantic characters unless there's a specific focus on societal issues. There's really not much different in writing with gay or straight characters in relationships. At the end of the day it's two imaginary people smacking lips.

 

[DireBadger]

True story. I was (over?) writing a big investigation novel. Anyways, I always like to turn a trope on its head when I can. Now then, in absolutely *any* two buddies investigating movie, there just HAS to be the strip club. There's always a stripper, who just *happens* to have all the perfect information, and is willing to drop it on them. Honestly, why don't they just give strippers guns and badges, let them solve murders. They already know everything, right.

Okay. In the course of their legwork, they have to go to the gay dance club. Then I got mileage out of it, because it seemed to be "working". So I made the gay dance club a little bit of a recurring theme for a small patch in the novel. If there's an official gay "board of good taste" I have to run it past, to get "certified"... let me know.

For some reason, in my experience, intentionally 'gay themed clubs' and good taste go together like peanut butter and sidewalk chalk.
In fact, most 'sexuality themed clubs' are in hilariously bad taste. "Eyes wide shut" was a cute movie, but it doesn't really work that way.

 

[BearlyAlive]

Who cares if they're gay, gray, prey, or whatever else if they're written as good, functioning characters? While gay or genderbent MCs aren't something I actively look for, I don't stop a story just because of it. If you avoid politicking the heck out of being gay or making the whole character about being gay, then all's well.

I mean, you could go over the top with the gay cliches and own it as Dragon Quest 12 did, but that'd be risky and only works if the character arc profits from it as well.

I personally had some great fun writing femboy characters that prey on guys for sport and giggles. But femboys seem to be some weird in-between zone neither side really claims for themselves...

 

[corruption]

. . . . Just had a thought. Never a good thing in my case
How many people write stories with a lesbian protagonist just as an excuse to create graphic lesbian fanfic or scenes?
Come on, you KNOW some people would do it. Same with Gay protagonists.
I also would not be surprised if a few supposedly straight characters in modern stories that had moment people question had those moments just for the porn thus produced. If you want an example, look up Xenia fanfics, if they are still around.

 

[CharlesEBrown]

. . . . Just had a thought. Never a good thing in my case
How many people write stories with a lesbian protagonist just as an excuse to create graphic lesbian fanfic or scenes?
Come on, you KNOW some people would do it. Same with Gay protagonists.
I also would not be surprised if a few supposedly straight characters in modern stories that had moment people question had those moments just for the porn thus produced. If you want an example, look up Xenia fanfics, if they are still around.

One reason I tend to avoid fan fiction was discovering the existence of Xena fanfics that went into explicit detail...
At least most of the KirkSpock stories didn't go that far (I've heard one DID but I've only seen two, and they were quite mild - one so much so it was included in a collection of short Star Trek fiction, that also included "Visit to a Strange Planet Revisited" - where Shatner, Kelley and Nimoy are transported to the actual Enterprise while Kirk, Spock and McCoy are sent to the show's set by a transporter malfunction).

 

[TinaMigarlo]

One reason I tend to avoid fan fiction was discovering the existence of Xena fanfics that went into explicit detail...

you don't say, lol.
let me guess. Her and Gabrielle get it on, huh.

 

[CharlesEBrown]

you don't say, lol.
let me guess. Her and Gabrielle get it on, huh.

Only read a paragraph before someone warned me that EVERYONE gets it on with Xena, male and female... but mostly Gabrielle.