(COLLEGE RANT) Why do minor subjects exist?

[Deleted member 54065]

It's supposed to be difficult.

Otherwise, it wouldn't feel university like enough.


K-12?

Is that KGB training?

That's only for presidential candidates.

K-12, or Kinder to Grade 12 is the current Philippine Education Curriculum. It is pretty controversial here because Filipinos only see it as two additional years (and expenses) to 10 years of basic education.

The Philippine Government enforced it to continue exporting people to other countries, since our industries are woefully underdeveloped.

Can't you test out of certain classes? When I was a freshman they said I could not take calculus but I did pre calc in highschool. I had to figure out how to meet the professor and get a form signed to be in the class.

If nothing else college teaches how to fight the system.

A lot of universities and colleges in the Philippines implement the 'block section' system wherein students assigned to their section can't choose (or try) a subject, unless they drop the whole course altogether.

Switching courses is allowed but is pretty difficult, especially for non-popular courses, since they want to stay afloat or they'll be dissolved.

One might ask, "If you don't like your course, why choose it?"

1) Family pressure. You want Fine Arts; they want you to be a doctor. If you don't comply, you won't get support.

2) Some colleges and universities have quotas in their courses. If you don't get admitted, you'll have to choose another course just to stay in school. And since many families here are poor, their choices for college are not that many.

For example, when I chose my university (because my family is poor, and I'm a state scholar), my initial course is Computer Science. However, my Math grades suck, so I chose Office Administration as a 'temporary course' with an intent to switch to ComSci once I got admitted.

College chairperson grilled me. College dean interrogated me. Result? They deemed my excuse as insufficient. I remained in my course, graduated in 2009, then took up education units in 2010.

 

[DaisukeHanashi]

It's supposed to be difficult.

Otherwise, it wouldn't feel university like enough.

Even I prefer to do 3 projects for each MAJOR subject per term (prelim, midterm, finals) without worrying about some pointless minors.

Forcing such “difficulties” while giving no necessary benefits and impacts is a reason why most students (even the studious ones… at least in here) can’t take college so seriously after realizing how irrelevant they are.

 

[georgelee5786]

So they can make more money

 

[Kenjona]

College is there to give you a broad based education, not a narrow focused one. Minors AKA Electives "Let You Explore New Fields of Study", in case you see something that is a better fit for you and make the student more "Well Rounded" as a potential leader out in the world. This is not new to any western based college program anywhere in the world. It has been so since colleges/university degrees started becoming codified.

The K-12 grades was to bring it in line with the rest of the western worlds ideas in education. You do not need anything past 8th grade for a laborer, but you do need that last 4 years for any technical blue collar work (Electrician, Carpenter (not laborer or helper and actual carpenter), Mason (not laborer or helper and actual Mason) and so on because now they must be able to read drawings, do basic algebra and must be able to read/write coherently.

I deal with Both blue collar technical field workers and technical college workers. No way is a 10 year educated person getting through the door of any business I work with, except as a semi-permanent laborer, who will be dropped first as soon as they are unneeded.

 

[Bloodysin28]

Google how much money universities make and how it can be used to launder money and it will explain everything about university bullshit.

 

[GuiltyZ100]

They want your money, as much as they can reasonably reason and get away with. My academic discipline could have been finished within 3 years (Admitted by one of my professors), with much better time management and subjects, unfortunately the first 2 YEARS were dedicated to general education subject that you could and should have learned in primary and secondary schooling. What use are PE, Filipino language, geography, religion, Philippine history (Rizal), and math (Yeah, the one you learn in highschool) subjects to my future profession (It's related to international courses)?

Philippines here, can't get ahead without a diploma, connections, or luck. K-12 was launched haphazardly, we never had experience in such things and it shows. If we had the same level and quality of education as in the West it might have been fine, unfortunately its just there to show you had 12 years of education, no matter how useless in some areas.

Note: When we mean minors, we mean general education courses, not electives. At least electives are useful.

 

[RepresentingThree]

Beats me. This is the Philippines. Job hunting here can get unreasonably stupid.

It's like that here in the USA as well. Sometimes people are lucky and made connections during the education process, but usually you need at least a few years in the bottom rung. Even after the expensive years of education.

 

[RepresentingCaution]

Are you talking about General Education/GE?
At my university, having a minor was a choice. I minored in psychology and loved those courses.

Are you at a community college or a 4-year? I went straight into a 4-year and got to choose how I wanted to fulfill me GE requirements, so I chose things like Native American Studies and had a blast. Education is more fun when you have more choices.

That's why I'm going to do a hybrid homeschool and public school thing with my kid. Officially, I'm going arrange an independent study plan so he can choose every day if he wants to learn at school or learn at home. I don't want him sitting in a classroom bored out of his skull by things he already knows when he could be working ahead or developing other skills. We might just drop by school for lunch and recess every day so he can socialize.

I never did this personally, but I've heard that, at the university level, you can get course credit by talking to the dean and taking a test instead of sitting through the lectures.

 

[Deleted member 54065]

It's like that here in the USA as well. Sometimes people are lucky and made connections during the education process, but usually you need at least a few years in the bottom rung. Even after the expensive years of education.

I think the reason for this is either those already in the industry are lazy to spend time and effort training newly-graduates (they'd go once they found a greener pasture anyway), or everyone's busy with their jobs atm no one's got a moment to spare.

 

[Kenjona]

I think the reason for this is either those already in the industry are lazy to spend time and effort training newly-graduates (they'd go once they found a greener pasture anyway), or everyone's busy with their jobs atm no one's got a moment to spare.

Nope it is for an even worse reason. Most employment adverts try and weed out everyone but stellar performers. But many end up weeding out everyone, if you go by the letter of what they wrote. I need to find the advert that had a specific Computer App requirement I saw before, it required something like 5 years experience on an App that had been out for much less than 4 years; the creators of the App were not qualified to work at that company on the App they created.

Here is a secret, job requirements are a wish list by the employer, not always what they will accept. But the less you have on the wish list, the less likely you will get the job, depending on how stiff the competition is.

Key words to look for in English are SHALL, MUST, Will and Required statements. Not only just the one sentence with it, but the entire paragraph may be modified by those words inclusion. If they show up, that is what the job is specifically looking for.

So stole these off of Indeed.com, I am going to bold & italicized my key points:

Spoiler: Job example 1; not really that great

RESPONSIBILITIES:
A XXXX client is seeking a Mainframe Cobol Programmer in XX, XX.
Summary:
In this role, the Mainframe Cobol Programmer will analyze and make the appropriate modifications. <Keyword included; this is the job in a nutshell extremely IMPORTANT!> This includes analyzing requirements, developing an appropriate design, writing new programs, editing existing modules, modifying new or existing reports, building or optimizing new or existing feeds, testing enhancements and implementing the proven improvements into the production environment. <Everything after that bolded & italicized part is also included as it is inclusive to the first sentence. If you do not have mainframe Cobol Programming Experience, do not apply for this job. Your wasting their time and yours.>

Responsibilities:

• Mine and manipulate data to build test data and test cases for multiple or complex projects

Document expected results

• In collaboration with the project team, develop and periodically confirm test schedule
• Implement Systems Integration Test Plan, including the comparison of actual results to pre-determined results
• Document and report on identified system testing issues in standard defect tracking tool
• Define system regression tests for future projects and for ongoing regression efforts; Transition system regression test cases to the QA regression team
• Identify defects in multiple environments and throughout all phases of the development life cycle and ensure that development groups address all open defects in a timely manner; Support production verification and validation
• Work in conjunction with all functional groups to identify potential future improvements to the overall process, requirements gathering and documentation or test templates

<The above is padding to give you an idea of what the job entails>

REQUIREMENTS:

• Bachelor's degree or equivalent experience is required. <Required statement they will not pull back from this, but if you are in the field but are not a Bachelor holder, you have some leeway. Expect 2 years of experience working at the level indicated in the Summary, for every year of a bachelor you are outside of.>
• <Everything past this point is negotiable as they do not include required, shall, must or will type statements. Note I said negotiable, if you do not have it will count against you. The more you do not have worse your interview will go.>
• 5+ years of hands-on mainframe development experience
• Stellar knowledge of COBOL II, JCL, DB2, VSAM & MVS Utilities
• Experience with QA, system development, and test project life cycle methodologies
• Ability to work optimally with product development and systems management
• Solid grasp of the software development process including analysis, design, coding, system and user testing, problem resolution and planning
• Excellent written and verbal communication skills
• High level of attention to detail
• Strong oral and written communication skills
• Good technical skills including a deep grasp of relational databases, file processing, application and web-enabling technologies
• Experience in the financial services industry area is a plus

<A very weaselly job requirements/desired list. In my opinion they are shooting for the moon, or are trying not say it is an independent senior level position. Probably to bring down the compensation requirements>

Spoiler: Job Description 2; very on point

Wastewater Treatment Operator​

Qualifications​

• High school or equivalent (Required) <This is a technical blue color job, so 12 year General Education or equivalent for the USA; having a GED, or relevant work experience in this field might help.>
• Day Shift (Required) <You are working a shift on days (Including weekends), your work scheduled time is going to be set in stone.>
• Work authorization (Required) <You must be able to work in the USA>
• Data collection: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>
• Water treatment: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>
• Industrial maintenance: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>

<This one did well in showing preferred, versus required qualifications.>

Full Job Description​

ProChem is seeking a responsible individual to safely and efficiently operate a wastewater treatment system in Culpeper, VA. You will work independently, with customer representatives, and alongside other ProChem technical resources daily to operate, maintain, and optimize the reuse equipment that we designed for our customer's particular industrial wastewater treatment needs. <Keyword statement>
This position is ideal for someone who is seeking a career in the water treatment industry or who is already in the industry and wishes to expand their skill set. We offer on-the-job training and full benefits for you and your family (company-subsidized).
ProChem's head offices are located in XXXX. This position reports directly to the site supervisor. The account is also supported by the other members of the account management team, who can all provide safety, technical, and professional training and guidance.

The successful candidate must: <Key word alert>be able to perform the required job duties, meet the required education and experience criteria, possess the required skills, meet the physical demands of the position, and commute reliably to the work location for the specified schedule. Preference will be given to candidates who possess skills and training marked as "preferred." <Keyword statement>

This position requires flexibility in work hours, vacation, and other scheduling considerations to meet the demands of the position occasionally or as needed.

Job Duties:

• Monitor and operate various water treatment technologies according to standard operating procedures and guidance from the account management team
• Provide professional and courteous support to our customers, maintaining a solutions-focused work ethic
• Follow quality control, safety, and PPE procedures
• Conduct regular operator rounds on all equipment and components
• Respond to system alarms
• Collect water samples for testing
• Change membranes, calibrate instruments, change filters, etc.
• Record data and update logs
• Drive a fork lift to load/unload and organize stock items such as chemistry and filters
• Maintain a clean, safe work environment
• Perform preventive and some corrective maintenance on equipment
• Follow all safety, ISO, and EPA guidelines and regulations
• Maintain a current Hazwoper 24 certification (company sponsored)

<The above is nice to have experience in, but not required as they will probably train you>

Desired Skills & Experience:

• Experience with chemicals and corrosives (preferred)
• Experience with fluid handling equipment (preferred)
• Experience with electrical systems and/or controls systems (preferred)
• Mechanical ability (preferred)
• Ability to work autonomously and with a team (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Ability to follow work instructions (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Ability to troubleshoot (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Knowledge of wastewater/water sampling procedures (preferred)
• Excellent written and oral communication skills (required)
• Basic computer software skills such as Microsoft Excel and Microsoft Word (preferred)

Desired Education & Experience:

• High school diploma (required) <Key word again though they did say this earlier, that is twice now>
• Previous experience working in an industrial setting (preferred)
• Previous experience in a customer-facing role (preferred)

Physical Demands & Environment: This position requires working indoors and outdoors during all weather conditions. The work facilities include modest amenities. The individual will be exposed to noise from machinery and a variety of odors. This position requires the individual to work with hazardous chemicals and compounds. The position requires moderate activity with frequent walking, standing for long periods, sitting, bending, stooping, reaching, pulling, lifting, and ladder work. It may require the ability to lift up to 100 pounds occasionally and 50 pounds regularly. The position requires the employee work around electricity and water, plumbing equipment, and a variety of chemical used within the wastewater treatment systems.
<Every single sentence has the keyword "Required" in it, they made sure to place that keyword in there, because of the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA); as a point that those with disabilities that prevent the doing of any of the above, will not be considered for the job outright.

This position has access to a climate controlled office space.
Note: The content of this job ad is not designed or intended to cover or contain a comprehensive listing of activities, duties, responsibilities, physical requirements, or skills required of an employee in this position. Duties, responsibilities, and activities may change at any time with or without notice.

Please submit a resume to express interest in this position.
ProChem Inc. is a custom-tailored water treatment solutions provider. We serve heavy industrial manufacturing facilities in the U.S. by providing innovative solutions that are designed specifically to meet their unique needs. Each solution is designed and built by ProChem Inc. on a project basis. Operations Technicians are part of the ProChem O&M Services, which provides daily, on-site operation of our customers' water treatment program. Learn more about ProChem at prochemwater.com.
ProChem's mission is to advance our customers' water treatment strategies through innovative treatment solutions supported by a comprehensive set of services, while adhering to industry safety, environmental, and ISO standards. Our number one operating priority is to protect people and the environment. The ProChem team consists of chemists, engineers, technicians, and other professionals who dedicate their careers to preserving water quality and availability. Join a team that is engineering customer satisfaction.
ProChem is an equal opportunity employer. Employment decisions are based on merit and business needs, and not on race, color, citizenship status, national origin, ancestry, gender identification, sexual orientation, age, religion, creed, disability, marital status, genetic information, status covered as veteran, pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions including lactation, political affiliation, or any other protected status with applicable federal, state, and local laws. It is the policy of ProChem to comply with all the relevant and applicable provisions of the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA).
PCI prohibits the discrimination against employees and otherwise qualified applicants related to pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions, including lactation, in any term or condition of employment. Reasonable accommodation will be provided to any employee/applicant who cannot, or will not, be able to perform their duties because of pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions, as long as such accommodation does not constitute and undue hardship. The full pregnancy non-discrimination policy will be provided to you upon request or upon disclosure of pregnancy or a related condition. <Keyword statements>
ProChem is a drug-free workplace. We have a standard of conduct, which prohibits the unlawful possession, use, or distribution of illicit drugs and alcohol by employees on ProChem's site and/or client sites as part of ProChem's activities. ProChem will impose disciplinary sanctions in employees ranging from educational and rehabilitation efforts up to and including expulsion or termination of employment and referral for prosecution for violations of the standards of conduct. Each situation is looked at on a case-by-case basis. <Keyword statement>
This company participates in E-Verify and will provide the federal government with your Form I-9 information to confirm that you are authorized to work in the U.S.<Keyword statement>
Este empleador participa en E-Verify y proporcionara al gobierno federal la informacion de su Formulario I-9 para confirmar que usted esta autorizado para trabajar en los EE.UU.

Schedule:

• 12 hour shift
• Day shift
• Holidays
• Monday to Friday
• Overtime
• Weekend availability

COVID-19 considerations:
PCI Employees must comply with customer's and PCI's COVID-19 safety protocols and sick policies. <Note the must statement>

Application Question(s):

• We conduct preemployment background and drug screening, and job offers are contingent upon the results meeting policy guidelines. Results that do not meet policy guidelines will undergo an inquiry. If policy guidelines prevent it, the hiring process may be terminated. It is advisable that you take this into account before making final decisions related to current employment if an offer is extended to you. Do you understand and acknowledge this notification? <Keyword statement>
• Can you reliably commute to the Culpeper, VA location and/or will be relocating to do so? <Keyword statement>

Education:

• High school or equivalent (Required) <Key word again third time at that!>

Experience:

• Data collection: 1 year (Preferred)
• water treatment: 1 year (Preferred)
• Industrial maintenance: 1 year (Preferred)

Shift availability:

• Day Shift (Required) <Keyword statement>

 

[Deleted member 54065]

Nope it is for an even worse reason. Most employment adverts try and weed out everyone but stellar performers. But many end up weeding out everyone, if you go by the letter of what they wrote. I need to find the advert that an specific Computer App requirement I saw before, it required something like 5 years experience on an App that had been out for much less than 4 years; the creators of the App were not qualified to work at that company on the App they created.

Here is a secret, job requirements are a wish list by the employer, not always what they will accept. But the less you have on the wish list, the less likely you will get the job, depending on how stiff the competition is.

Key words to look for in English are SHALL, MUST, Will and Required statements. Not only just the one sentence with it, but the entire paragraph may be modified by those words inclusion. If they show up, that is what the job is specifically looking for.

So stole these off of Indeed.com, I am going to bold & italicized my key points:

Spoiler: Job example 1; not really that great

RESPONSIBILITIES:
A XXXX client is seeking a Mainframe Cobol Programmer in XX, XX.
Summary:
In this role, the Mainframe Cobol Programmer will analyze and make the appropriate modifications. <Keyword included; this is the job in a nutshell extremely IMPORTANT!> This includes analyzing requirements, developing an appropriate design, writing new programs, editing existing modules, modifying new or existing reports, building or optimizing new or existing feeds, testing enhancements and implementing the proven improvements into the production environment. <Everything after that bolded & italicized part is also included as it is inclusive to the first sentence. If you do not have mainframe Cobol Programming Experience, do not apply for this job. Your wasting their time and yours.>

Responsibilities:

• Mine and manipulate data to build test data and test cases for multiple or complex projects

Document expected results

• In collaboration with the project team, develop and periodically confirm test schedule
• Implement Systems Integration Test Plan, including the comparison of actual results to pre-determined results
• Document and report on identified system testing issues in standard defect tracking tool
• Define system regression tests for future projects and for ongoing regression efforts; Transition system regression test cases to the QA regression team
• Identify defects in multiple environments and throughout all phases of the development life cycle and ensure that development groups address all open defects in a timely manner; Support production verification and validation
• Work in conjunction with all functional groups to identify potential future improvements to the overall process, requirements gathering and documentation or test templates

<The above is padding to give you an idea of what the job entails>

REQUIREMENTS:

• Bachelor's degree or equivalent experience is required. <Required statement they will not pull back from this, but if you are in the field but are not a Bachelor holder, you have some leeway. Expect 2 years of experience working at the level indicated in the Summary, for every year of a bachelor you are outside of.>
• <Everything past this point is negotiable as they do not include required, shall, must or will type statements. Note I said negotiable, if you do not have it will count against you. The more you do not have worse your interview will go.>
• 5+ years of hands-on mainframe development experience
• Stellar knowledge of COBOL II, JCL, DB2, VSAM & MVS Utilities
• Experience with QA, system development, and test project life cycle methodologies
• Ability to work optimally with product development and systems management
• Solid grasp of the software development process including analysis, design, coding, system and user testing, problem resolution and planning
• Excellent written and verbal communication skills
• High level of attention to detail
• Strong oral and written communication skills
• Good technical skills including a deep grasp of relational databases, file processing, application and web-enabling technologies
• Experience in the financial services industry area is a plus

<A very weaselly job requirements/desired list. In my opinion they are shooting for the moon, or are trying not say it is an independent senior level position. Probably to bring down the compensation requirements>

Spoiler: Job Description 2; very on point

Wastewater Treatment Operator​

Qualifications​

• High school or equivalent (Required) <This is a technical blue color job, so 12 year General Education or equivalent for the USA; having a GED, or relevant work experience in this field might help.>
• Day Shift (Required) <You are working a shift on days (Including weekends), your work scheduled time is going to be set in stone.>
• Work authorization (Required) <You must be able to work in the USA>
• Data collection: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>
• Water treatment: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>
• Industrial maintenance: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>

<This one did well in showing preferred, versus required qualifications.>

Full Job Description​

ProChem is seeking a responsible individual to safely and efficiently operate a wastewater treatment system in Culpeper, VA. You will work independently, with customer representatives, and alongside other ProChem technical resources daily to operate, maintain, and optimize the reuse equipment that we designed for our customer's particular industrial wastewater treatment needs. <Keyword statement>
This position is ideal for someone who is seeking a career in the water treatment industry or who is already in the industry and wishes to expand their skill set. We offer on-the-job training and full benefits for you and your family (company-subsidized).
ProChem's head offices are located in XXXX. This position reports directly to the site supervisor. The account is also supported by the other members of the account management team, who can all provide safety, technical, and professional training and guidance.

The successful candidate must: <Key word alert>be able to perform the required job duties, meet the required education and experience criteria, possess the required skills, meet the physical demands of the position, and commute reliably to the work location for the specified schedule. Preference will be given to candidates who possess skills and training marked as "preferred." <Keyword statement>

This position requires flexibility in work hours, vacation, and other scheduling considerations to meet the demands of the position occasionally or as needed.

Job Duties:

• Monitor and operate various water treatment technologies according to standard operating procedures and guidance from the account management team
• Provide professional and courteous support to our customers, maintaining a solutions-focused work ethic
• Follow quality control, safety, and PPE procedures
• Conduct regular operator rounds on all equipment and components
• Respond to system alarms
• Collect water samples for testing
• Change membranes, calibrate instruments, change filters, etc.
• Record data and update logs
• Drive a fork lift to load/unload and organize stock items such as chemistry and filters
• Maintain a clean, safe work environment
• Perform preventive and some corrective maintenance on equipment
• Follow all safety, ISO, and EPA guidelines and regulations
• Maintain a current Hazwoper 24 certification (company sponsored)

<The above is nice to have experience in, but not required as they will probably train you>

Desired Skills & Experience:

• Experience with chemicals and corrosives (preferred)
• Experience with fluid handling equipment (preferred)
• Experience with electrical systems and/or controls systems (preferred)
• Mechanical ability (preferred)
• Ability to work autonomously and with a team (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Ability to follow work instructions (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Ability to troubleshoot (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Knowledge of wastewater/water sampling procedures (preferred)
• Excellent written and oral communication skills (required)
• Basic computer software skills such as Microsoft Excel and Microsoft Word (preferred)

Desired Education & Experience:

• High school diploma (required) <Key word again though they did say this earlier, that is twice now>
• Previous experience working in an industrial setting (preferred)
• Previous experience in a customer-facing role (preferred)

Physical Demands & Environment: This position requires working indoors and outdoors during all weather conditions. The work facilities include modest amenities. The individual will be exposed to noise from machinery and a variety of odors. This position requires the individual to work with hazardous chemicals and compounds. The position requires moderate activity with frequent walking, standing for long periods, sitting, bending, stooping, reaching, pulling, lifting, and ladder work. It may require the ability to lift up to 100 pounds occasionally and 50 pounds regularly. The position requires the employee work around electricity and water, plumbing equipment, and a variety of chemical used within the wastewater treatment systems.
<Every single sentence has the keyword "Required" in it, they made sure to place that keyword in there, because of the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA); as a point that those with disabilities that prevent the doing of any of the above, will not be considered for the job outright.

This position has access to a climate controlled office space.
Note: The content of this job ad is not designed or intended to cover or contain a comprehensive listing of activities, duties, responsibilities, physical requirements, or skills required of an employee in this position. Duties, responsibilities, and activities may change at any time with or without notice.

Please submit a resume to express interest in this position.
ProChem Inc. is a custom-tailored water treatment solutions provider. We serve heavy industrial manufacturing facilities in the U.S. by providing innovative solutions that are designed specifically to meet their unique needs. Each solution is designed and built by ProChem Inc. on a project basis. Operations Technicians are part of the ProChem O&M Services, which provides daily, on-site operation of our customers' water treatment program. Learn more about ProChem at prochemwater.com.
ProChem's mission is to advance our customers' water treatment strategies through innovative treatment solutions supported by a comprehensive set of services, while adhering to industry safety, environmental, and ISO standards. Our number one operating priority is to protect people and the environment. The ProChem team consists of chemists, engineers, technicians, and other professionals who dedicate their careers to preserving water quality and availability. Join a team that is engineering customer satisfaction.
ProChem is an equal opportunity employer. Employment decisions are based on merit and business needs, and not on race, color, citizenship status, national origin, ancestry, gender identification, sexual orientation, age, religion, creed, disability, marital status, genetic information, status covered as veteran, pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions including lactation, political affiliation, or any other protected status with applicable federal, state, and local laws. It is the policy of ProChem to comply with all the relevant and applicable provisions of the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA).
PCI prohibits the discrimination against employees and otherwise qualified applicants related to pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions, including lactation, in any term or condition of employment. Reasonable accommodation will be provided to any employee/applicant who cannot, or will not, be able to perform their duties because of pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions, as long as such accommodation does not constitute and undue hardship. The full pregnancy non-discrimination policy will be provided to you upon request or upon disclosure of pregnancy or a related condition. <Keyword statements>
ProChem is a drug-free workplace. We have a standard of conduct, which prohibits the unlawful possession, use, or distribution of illicit drugs and alcohol by employees on ProChem's site and/or client sites as part of ProChem's activities. ProChem will impose disciplinary sanctions in employees ranging from educational and rehabilitation efforts up to and including expulsion or termination of employment and referral for prosecution for violations of the standards of conduct. Each situation is looked at on a case-by-case basis. <Keyword statement>
This company participates in E-Verify and will provide the federal government with your Form I-9 information to confirm that you are authorized to work in the U.S.<Keyword statement>
Este empleador participa en E-Verify y proporcionara al gobierno federal la informacion de su Formulario I-9 para confirmar que usted esta autorizado para trabajar en los EE.UU.

Schedule:

• 12 hour shift
• Day shift
• Holidays
• Monday to Friday
• Overtime
• Weekend availability

COVID-19 considerations:
PCI Employees must comply with customer's and PCI's COVID-19 safety protocols and sick policies. <Note the must statement>

Application Question(s):

• We conduct preemployment background and drug screening, and job offers are contingent upon the results meeting policy guidelines. Results that do not meet policy guidelines will undergo an inquiry. If policy guidelines prevent it, the hiring process may be terminated. It is advisable that you take this into account before making final decisions related to current employment if an offer is extended to you. Do you understand and acknowledge this notification? <Keyword statement>
• Can you reliably commute to the Culpeper, VA location and/or will be relocating to do so? <Keyword statement>

Education:

• High school or equivalent (Required) <Key word again third time at that!>

Experience:

• Data collection: 1 year (Preferred)
• water treatment: 1 year (Preferred)
• Industrial maintenance: 1 year (Preferred)

Shift availability:

• Day Shift (Required) <Keyword statement>

Oh right, employers want more for less payment.

Best bet nowadays is to do business, if one has the capital, skills and attitude to make one.

 

[Kenjona]

Oh right, employers want more for less payment.

Best bet nowadays is to do business, if one has the capital to make one.

A lot of issues are coming full circle now in the US, as the baby boomers are leaving the job force. Gen X'ers became entrepreneurs because they could not progress in many fields as their were a glut of baby boomers in them. But they have aged out of a lot of positions (Are nearing retirement themselves) and it is on very much less experienced generations to take those spots.

There was a very bad hiring freeze back in the 2000's-2015, where those with degrees were just not getting jobs in the fields they trained in, other places just tried to do more with what they had. The financial crisis of 2008 exacerbated everything.
So come the 2015+ we had a lack of skilled experienced lower level employees that could step up into the more experienced higher level positions.

Then Covid hit, now many industries are fighting over qualified bodies, and many still have the old idea they need to shoot for the moon on every hire they can. Filling a Supervisor position that should be held buy someone competent, with 15+ years of experience is asking for trouble in some industries, especially in the blue collar fields related to infrastructure and energy. But you do what you can.

Oh right, employers want more for less payment.

Best bet nowadays is to do business, if one has the capital, skills and attitude to make one.

Many are trying, but it is a very clustered field in some ways as, to many are following the herd.

 

[Deleted member 54065]

A lot of issues are coming full circle now in the US, as the baby boomers are leaving the job force. Gen X'ers became entrepreneurs because they could not progress in many fields as their were a glut of baby boomers in them. But they have aged out of a lot of positions (Are nearing retirement themselves) and it is on very much less experienced generations to take those spots.

There was a very bad hiring freeze back in the 2000's-2015, where those with degrees were just not getting jobs in the fields they trained in, other places just tried to do more with what they had. The financial crisis of 2008 exacerbated everything.
So come the 2015+ we had a lack of skilled experienced lower level employees that could step up into the more experienced higher level positions.

Then Covid hit, now many industries are fighting over qualified bodies, and many still have the old idea they need to shoot for the moon on every hire they can. Filling a Supervisor position that should be held buy someone competent, with 15+ years of experience is asking for trouble in some industries, especially in the blue collar fields related to infrastructure and energy. But you do what you can.

Many are trying, but it is a very clustered field in some ways as, to many are following the herd.

Yeah, I agree with this, as I (owned printing business) got a lot of competition. That's why I'm diversifying my finances (also doing baking, law consultations, illustration commissions, and computer servicing).

 

[melchi]

Nope it is for an even worse reason. Most employment adverts try and weed out everyone but stellar performers. But many end up weeding out everyone, if you go by the letter of what they wrote. I need to find the advert that had a specific Computer App requirement I saw before, it required something like 5 years experience on an App that had been out for much less than 4 years; the creators of the App were not qualified to work at that company on the App they created.

Here is a secret, job requirements are a wish list by the employer, not always what they will accept. But the less you have on the wish list, the less likely you will get the job, depending on how stiff the competition is.

Key words to look for in English are SHALL, MUST, Will and Required statements. Not only just the one sentence with it, but the entire paragraph may be modified by those words inclusion. If they show up, that is what the job is specifically looking for.

So stole these off of Indeed.com, I am going to bold & italicized my key points:

Spoiler: Job example 1; not really that great

RESPONSIBILITIES:
A XXXX client is seeking a Mainframe Cobol Programmer in XX, XX.
Summary:
In this role, the Mainframe Cobol Programmer will analyze and make the appropriate modifications. <Keyword included; this is the job in a nutshell extremely IMPORTANT!> This includes analyzing requirements, developing an appropriate design, writing new programs, editing existing modules, modifying new or existing reports, building or optimizing new or existing feeds, testing enhancements and implementing the proven improvements into the production environment. <Everything after that bolded & italicized part is also included as it is inclusive to the first sentence. If you do not have mainframe Cobol Programming Experience, do not apply for this job. Your wasting their time and yours.>

Responsibilities:

• Mine and manipulate data to build test data and test cases for multiple or complex projects

Document expected results

• In collaboration with the project team, develop and periodically confirm test schedule
• Implement Systems Integration Test Plan, including the comparison of actual results to pre-determined results
• Document and report on identified system testing issues in standard defect tracking tool
• Define system regression tests for future projects and for ongoing regression efforts; Transition system regression test cases to the QA regression team
• Identify defects in multiple environments and throughout all phases of the development life cycle and ensure that development groups address all open defects in a timely manner; Support production verification and validation
• Work in conjunction with all functional groups to identify potential future improvements to the overall process, requirements gathering and documentation or test templates

<The above is padding to give you an idea of what the job entails>

REQUIREMENTS:

• Bachelor's degree or equivalent experience is required. <Required statement they will not pull back from this, but if you are in the field but are not a Bachelor holder, you have some leeway. Expect 2 years of experience working at the level indicated in the Summary, for every year of a bachelor you are outside of.>
• <Everything past this point is negotiable as they do not include required, shall, must or will type statements. Note I said negotiable, if you do not have it will count against you. The more you do not have worse your interview will go.>
• 5+ years of hands-on mainframe development experience
• Stellar knowledge of COBOL II, JCL, DB2, VSAM & MVS Utilities
• Experience with QA, system development, and test project life cycle methodologies
• Ability to work optimally with product development and systems management
• Solid grasp of the software development process including analysis, design, coding, system and user testing, problem resolution and planning
• Excellent written and verbal communication skills
• High level of attention to detail
• Strong oral and written communication skills
• Good technical skills including a deep grasp of relational databases, file processing, application and web-enabling technologies
• Experience in the financial services industry area is a plus

<A very weaselly job requirements/desired list. In my opinion they are shooting for the moon, or are trying not say it is an independent senior level position. Probably to bring down the compensation requirements>

Spoiler: Job Description 2; very on point

Wastewater Treatment Operator​

Qualifications​

• High school or equivalent (Required) <This is a technical blue color job, so 12 year General Education or equivalent for the USA; having a GED, or relevant work experience in this field might help.>
• Day Shift (Required) <You are working a shift on days (Including weekends), your work scheduled time is going to be set in stone.>
• Work authorization (Required) <You must be able to work in the USA>
• Data collection: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>
• Water treatment: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>
• Industrial maintenance: 1 year (Preferred) <Negotiable>

<This one did well in showing preferred, versus required qualifications.>

Full Job Description​

ProChem is seeking a responsible individual to safely and efficiently operate a wastewater treatment system in Culpeper, VA. You will work independently, with customer representatives, and alongside other ProChem technical resources daily to operate, maintain, and optimize the reuse equipment that we designed for our customer's particular industrial wastewater treatment needs. <Keyword statement>
This position is ideal for someone who is seeking a career in the water treatment industry or who is already in the industry and wishes to expand their skill set. We offer on-the-job training and full benefits for you and your family (company-subsidized).
ProChem's head offices are located in XXXX. This position reports directly to the site supervisor. The account is also supported by the other members of the account management team, who can all provide safety, technical, and professional training and guidance.

The successful candidate must: <Key word alert>be able to perform the required job duties, meet the required education and experience criteria, possess the required skills, meet the physical demands of the position, and commute reliably to the work location for the specified schedule. Preference will be given to candidates who possess skills and training marked as "preferred." <Keyword statement>

This position requires flexibility in work hours, vacation, and other scheduling considerations to meet the demands of the position occasionally or as needed.

Job Duties:

• Monitor and operate various water treatment technologies according to standard operating procedures and guidance from the account management team
• Provide professional and courteous support to our customers, maintaining a solutions-focused work ethic
• Follow quality control, safety, and PPE procedures
• Conduct regular operator rounds on all equipment and components
• Respond to system alarms
• Collect water samples for testing
• Change membranes, calibrate instruments, change filters, etc.
• Record data and update logs
• Drive a fork lift to load/unload and organize stock items such as chemistry and filters
• Maintain a clean, safe work environment
• Perform preventive and some corrective maintenance on equipment
• Follow all safety, ISO, and EPA guidelines and regulations
• Maintain a current Hazwoper 24 certification (company sponsored)

<The above is nice to have experience in, but not required as they will probably train you>

Desired Skills & Experience:

• Experience with chemicals and corrosives (preferred)
• Experience with fluid handling equipment (preferred)
• Experience with electrical systems and/or controls systems (preferred)
• Mechanical ability (preferred)
• Ability to work autonomously and with a team (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Ability to follow work instructions (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Ability to troubleshoot (required) <Key word; this is a statement that might get you fired later on, or not hired if they sense you have some issues in the interview.>
• Knowledge of wastewater/water sampling procedures (preferred)
• Excellent written and oral communication skills (required)
• Basic computer software skills such as Microsoft Excel and Microsoft Word (preferred)

Desired Education & Experience:

• High school diploma (required) <Key word again though they did say this earlier, that is twice now>
• Previous experience working in an industrial setting (preferred)
• Previous experience in a customer-facing role (preferred)

Physical Demands & Environment: This position requires working indoors and outdoors during all weather conditions. The work facilities include modest amenities. The individual will be exposed to noise from machinery and a variety of odors. This position requires the individual to work with hazardous chemicals and compounds. The position requires moderate activity with frequent walking, standing for long periods, sitting, bending, stooping, reaching, pulling, lifting, and ladder work. It may require the ability to lift up to 100 pounds occasionally and 50 pounds regularly. The position requires the employee work around electricity and water, plumbing equipment, and a variety of chemical used within the wastewater treatment systems.
<Every single sentence has the keyword "Required" in it, they made sure to place that keyword in there, because of the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA); as a point that those with disabilities that prevent the doing of any of the above, will not be considered for the job outright.

This position has access to a climate controlled office space.
Note: The content of this job ad is not designed or intended to cover or contain a comprehensive listing of activities, duties, responsibilities, physical requirements, or skills required of an employee in this position. Duties, responsibilities, and activities may change at any time with or without notice.

Please submit a resume to express interest in this position.
ProChem Inc. is a custom-tailored water treatment solutions provider. We serve heavy industrial manufacturing facilities in the U.S. by providing innovative solutions that are designed specifically to meet their unique needs. Each solution is designed and built by ProChem Inc. on a project basis. Operations Technicians are part of the ProChem O&M Services, which provides daily, on-site operation of our customers' water treatment program. Learn more about ProChem at prochemwater.com.
ProChem's mission is to advance our customers' water treatment strategies through innovative treatment solutions supported by a comprehensive set of services, while adhering to industry safety, environmental, and ISO standards. Our number one operating priority is to protect people and the environment. The ProChem team consists of chemists, engineers, technicians, and other professionals who dedicate their careers to preserving water quality and availability. Join a team that is engineering customer satisfaction.
ProChem is an equal opportunity employer. Employment decisions are based on merit and business needs, and not on race, color, citizenship status, national origin, ancestry, gender identification, sexual orientation, age, religion, creed, disability, marital status, genetic information, status covered as veteran, pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions including lactation, political affiliation, or any other protected status with applicable federal, state, and local laws. It is the policy of ProChem to comply with all the relevant and applicable provisions of the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA).
PCI prohibits the discrimination against employees and otherwise qualified applicants related to pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions, including lactation, in any term or condition of employment. Reasonable accommodation will be provided to any employee/applicant who cannot, or will not, be able to perform their duties because of pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions, as long as such accommodation does not constitute and undue hardship. The full pregnancy non-discrimination policy will be provided to you upon request or upon disclosure of pregnancy or a related condition. <Keyword statements>
ProChem is a drug-free workplace. We have a standard of conduct, which prohibits the unlawful possession, use, or distribution of illicit drugs and alcohol by employees on ProChem's site and/or client sites as part of ProChem's activities. ProChem will impose disciplinary sanctions in employees ranging from educational and rehabilitation efforts up to and including expulsion or termination of employment and referral for prosecution for violations of the standards of conduct. Each situation is looked at on a case-by-case basis. <Keyword statement>
This company participates in E-Verify and will provide the federal government with your Form I-9 information to confirm that you are authorized to work in the U.S.<Keyword statement>
Este empleador participa en E-Verify y proporcionara al gobierno federal la informacion de su Formulario I-9 para confirmar que usted esta autorizado para trabajar en los EE.UU.

Schedule:

• 12 hour shift
• Day shift
• Holidays
• Monday to Friday
• Overtime
• Weekend availability

COVID-19 considerations:
PCI Employees must comply with customer's and PCI's COVID-19 safety protocols and sick policies. <Note the must statement>

Application Question(s):

• We conduct preemployment background and drug screening, and job offers are contingent upon the results meeting policy guidelines. Results that do not meet policy guidelines will undergo an inquiry. If policy guidelines prevent it, the hiring process may be terminated. It is advisable that you take this into account before making final decisions related to current employment if an offer is extended to you. Do you understand and acknowledge this notification? <Keyword statement>
• Can you reliably commute to the Culpeper, VA location and/or will be relocating to do so? <Keyword statement>

Education:

• High school or equivalent (Required) <Key word again third time at that!>

Experience:

• Data collection: 1 year (Preferred)
• water treatment: 1 year (Preferred)
• Industrial maintenance: 1 year (Preferred)

Shift availability:

• Day Shift (Required) <Keyword statement>

Oh yeah, people get into their fields in creative ways sometimes. I read Ken Williams memoir (Founder of sierra online) and he took a 2 year school on programing, then tried to get a job but didn't have the experience in the exact mainframe they wanted but led on that he did. He worked the job and tried his best to figure it out on the job but eventually got fired for misrepresenting his skillset. However, he was good enough with that mainframe with the OJT that he got from the previous job and found something similar in a competing company. I thought that was sorta interesting.

 

[Poleg]

So you can pay more.

Yeah, they do this dumb shit, so they can justify the ridiculously high cost.

 

[Jemini]

Bruh, how we gonna get some experience after we just freshly graduate out of college? Like, what do they expect from some potential and promising beginners? Unless internships can be considered as that, but I still feel sad for others who haven't passed through some minor subjects that they have missed years ago while doing their internships. Like, I wouldn't want that kind of miserable situation to be happened to me in a future.

That's just what it looks like when the job market is saturated. It becomes a "buyer's market" because there are more available workers than there are jobs for them, and the employers can get away with asking for experience because there actually ARE workers available who have experience in the field out-competing the new fresh-out-of-college kids.

It's not the employers' job to worry about the long-term health of the job market. Their only job is to increase their own profits, which means hiring the most capable worker for the job. So, they go for the best workers, the ones who have experience, and leave the role of allowing the youths to get experience to some other company. Then, when everyone is doing the same, it creates a situation where NO ONE is giving jobs to the next generation.

 

[Narcissistic_loser]

They are useless and the teachers always feel like majors.