Recommendations antivillains

[ThrillingHuman]

What is an antivillain?

An Anti-Villain is the opposite of an Anti-Hero — a character with heroic goals, personality traits, and/or virtues who is ultimately the villain.

- from tvtropes.org
EDIT:
A situation where: I need to do do [good thing™], but the things unfold in a way where I have no other choice but to do [bad thing™], whether it is due to an extremelly complicated system of circumstances that challenges my own beliefs and principles forcing me to make tough choices, or just due to poor luck - that's an antivillain.

A situation where: I am severely and comically misguided and self-righteous but I will do [bad thing™] to carry out [good thing™] at the end of the day - is not.
So, depending on the actual story (which I have not read), Doctor DIRE may or may not be an antivillain.

 

[DiscoDream]

So you're looking for competent 'bad guys'?

 

[TroubleFait]

Well yes, but actually no.

Take Doctor Doom, sometimes he saves the world but that never makes him the hero. It doesn't always make him the bad guy though.

My favourite example is Doctor DIRE, she's doing all she does to save the world and make it a better place, honest, but if it requires her to conquer it it's not her fault... it's from the author of Threadbare. Looks a lot like a Dr Doom expy but there's significant differences that make her a character of her own.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

Well yes, but actually no.

Take Doctor Doom, sometimes he saves the world but that never makes him the hero. It doesn't always make him the bad guy though.

My favourite example is Doctor DIRE, she's doing all she does to save the world and make it a better place, honest, but if it requires her to conquer it it's not her fault... it's from the author of Threadbare. Looks a lot like a Dr Doom expy but there's significant differences that make her a character of her own.

What about Peacemaker?

 

[DarkeReises]

Well yes, but actually no.

Take Doctor Doom, sometimes he saves the world but that never makes him the hero. It doesn't always make him the bad guy though.

My favourite example is Doctor DIRE, she's doing all she does to save the world and make it a better place, honest, but if it requires her to conquer it it's not her fault... it's from the author of Threadbare. Looks a lot like a Dr Doom expy but there's significant differences that make her a character of her own.

Doctor Dire would be an anti-hero then, not an anti-villain

 

[DiscoDream]

Well yes, but actually no.

Take Doctor Doom, sometimes he saves the world but that never makes him the hero. It doesn't always make him the bad guy though.

My favourite example is Doctor DIRE, she's doing all she does to save the world and make it a better place, honest, but if it requires her to conquer it it's not her fault... it's from the author of Threadbare. Looks a lot like a Dr Doom expy but there's significant differences that make her a character of her own.

Why would conquering the world make her a villain? If it's required for a better tomorrow, it's an acceptable loss, isn't it? Most 'heroes' end up conquering the 'evil' and 'backward' foreign nations of their world as well. A common trope in hero stories is how everyone who doesn't share the protags ideals are not only wrong, but are evil for being so.

 

[TroubleFait]

I've never watched/read it but if I get it right? Yes. Exactly that.

I'd say in Star Wars, Count Dooku half counts since he followed Palpatine because he was disgusted of the Republic's corruption. But then it's questionable because once you submit to the Dark Side no matter your reasons you aren't likely to make anything better.

Ozymandias from Watchmen is an anti-villain too.

Doctor Dire would be an anti-hero then, not an anti-villain

She's the protagonist of the story but she's always working on the other side of the law so I don't think you can call her a hero.
I'll admit she blurs the lines.

 

[DiscoDream]

I've never watched/read it but if I get it right? Yes. Exactly that.

I'd say in Star Wars, Count Dooku half counts since he followed Palpatine because he was disgusted of the Republic's corruption. But then it's questionable because once you submit to the Dark Side no matter your reasons you aren't likely to make anything better.

Ozymandias from Watchmen is an anti-villain too.


She's the protagonist of the story but she's always working on the other side of the law so I don't think you can call her a hero.
I'll admit she blurs the lines.

The dark side and light side are complicated. They're basically the concept of yin&yang, yet in the star wars universe, they attempt to completely remove the yang.
The Jedi are flawed from inception and are unlikely to do any good for anyone. It's a cult of fanatics who don't reproduce, abduct children at gunpoint and brainwash then to be holy knights(child soldiers). They're not allowed to reproduce or form bonds with anyone in their lifes. As emotional attachments lead to the 'dark side'
The entire series is pro-jedi propaganda. For reference, anyone who joins the dark side is hunted down and murdered for the crime of 'wrong thought'. Even the ones who do good for the galaxy.
If the story was told from Dooku's perspective, he'd be a tragic anti-hero.

 

[TroubleFait]

That's arguably more interesting than the Star Wars we had, but in Canon (both Extended Universe and Disney's afaik) the Dark Side does corrupt.
I'm not saying the Jedi were perfect mind you.

 

[Cipiteca396]

An anti-villain does the wrong thing for the right reasons. Basically, "The path to hell is paved in good intentions."

A character that tries to do the right thing and ends up screwing everyone over. A lot of redeemable villains are actually anti-villains, with the obvious 'My god, what have I done!?' being the moment they decide to switch sides. (Or not... Anakin...)

No recommendations from me though, sadly. It's a common enough trope, but I never really notice it.

 

[HelloHound]

the law does not dictate one's morals ?

 

[Twin]

Hmm, I think Madara Uchiha counts as an antivillain at least from my perspective. Even if he eventually failed(cause of course he is the villain) his plan would have virtually created a perfect world.

 

[DiscoDream]

That's arguably more interesting than the Star Wars we had, but in Canon (both Extended Universe and Disney's afaik) the Dark Side does corrupt.
I'm not saying the Jedi were perfect mind you.

This has been brewing in my thoughts for the last few days.
So, Yang is supposed to represent the feminine and chaotic. Star wars treats it as if it's inherently evil, and ruins everything that even dabbles in it. The entire series is about purging the feminine. ?

 

[RepresentingWrath]

This has been brewing in my thoughts for the last few days.
So, Yang is supposed to represent the feminine and chaotic. Star wars treats it as if it's inherently evil, and ruins everything that even dabbles in it. The entire series is about purging the feminine. ?

Yang is masculine.

 

[PeacefulMyst]

So, Yang is supposed to represent the feminine and chaotic

Bruh yin is the feminine and yang is the masculine