How to be good

[Green_Dolphin]

Being an aspirant writer without any proper literature background and as an ESL speaker, only driven by passion, I found it challenging to improve my skills. I want to learn, but to no avail, as what I gain is only a superficial understanding of it.

I want to ask but have no place to go, want to explore but have nothing to look for.

As for help from internet users, I also want it, but it is hard to find someone who is truly able to teach me what I want (even though I don't know what I want).

So, what do you guys think?

Writing chapters and posting them won’t do any good. Although there is feedback, it can only fill a hole or two but won’t save the ship.

 

[dukerino]

Writing chapters and posting them WILL do good. Best way you can improve is by doing.

 

[Green_Dolphin]

But I can't tell if what I'm currently writing is good enough—at the very least, correct in many aspects that I don't even know.

Is the pacing good?
Is the communication good?
Is this development already good enough in written form?
What should I do? What mistakes did I make? What should I improve? Where should I improve? And so much more—how do I know I learn something new and verify that it is indeed correct?

 

[Wanderrae]

Being an aspirant writer without any proper literature background and as an ESL speaker, only driven by passion, I found it challenging to improve my skills. I want to learn, but to no avail, as what I gain is only a superficial understanding of it.

I want to ask but have no place to go, want to explore but have nothing to look for.

As for help from internet users, I also want it, but it is hard to find someone who is truly able to teach me what I want (even though I don't know what I want).

So, what do you guys think?

Writing chapters and posting them won’t do any good. Although there is feedback, it can only fill a hole or two but won’t save the ship.

Fellow ESL here. I'm not going to be much of a help as I'm in a similar predicament. I've moved from spellchecker to spellchecker. I will say, though, that reading and writing, cutting and editing will improve your language skills over time. I've even undertaken the act of relearning the English language.

As for style, flow, prose, storytelling, it's all subjective. What I like to do is, extract a page from a writer I really like, then slowly rewrite what they wrote, they and dissect why they would even say that particular thing. Why add additional beat to a thought or subject. Why convey excessive detail to a bent over lamppost but conveniently ignore the crater next to it.

And therein lays the answer. It's all subjective. You have to read, absorb, write down, remove, rewrite.

A good story is almost always based on how good you understand tropes and writing.
Pacing, is a balancing game, how long do you want to portray a particular subject.

Communication? Are you referring to dialogue or to writer-to-reader communication?

All in all, you just have to use writing like a muscle. Write every day. Read every day. Try and get feedback every day.

 

[Wlel]

You know, youre a bit overthinking. My advice is just do it. Write, post, and wait for feedbacks. It will come to you eventually.

 

[dukerino]

But I can't tell if what I'm currently writing is good enough—at the very least, correct in many aspects that I don't even know.

Is the pacing good?
Is the communication good?
Is this development already good enough in written form?
What should I do? What mistakes did I make? What should I improve? Where should I improve? And so much more—how do I know I learn something new and verify that it is indeed correct?

You’re not going to know until you get the writing down on paper and in front of people. Your metaphor of the ship isn’t accurate. It’s not like you’re sinking—your supply of the written word is inexhaustible. Getting words out there is only going to strengthen you.

 

[Green_Dolphin]

Fellow ESL here. I'm not going to be much of a help as I'm in a similar predicament. I've moved from spellchecker to spellchecker. I will say, though, that reading and writing, cutting and editing will improve your language skills over time. I've even undertaken the act of relearning the English language.

As for style, flow, prose, storytelling, it's all subjective. What I like to do is, extract a page from a writer I really like, then slowly rewrite what they wrote, they and dissect why they would even say that particular thing. Why add additional beat to a thought or subject. Why convey excessive detail to a bent over lamppost but conveniently ignore the crater next to it.

And therein lays the answer. It's all subjective. You have to read, absorb, write down, remove, rewrite.

A good story is almost always based on how good you understand tropes and writing.
Pacing, is a balancing game, how long do you want to portray a particular subject.

Communication? Are you referring to dialogue or to writer-to-reader communication?

All in all, you just have to use writing like a muscle. Write every day. Read every day. Try and get feedback every day.

I also tried to relearn the English language, but that only fixed my very broken grammar. Afterward, I did improve, but the same problem remained—I don’t know where I went wrong.

So, yeah, I'll give your method a try. And about communication—my brain short-circuited back there. Yeah, I meant dialogue between characters.

You know, youre a bit overthinking. My advice is just do it. Write, post, and wait for feedbacks. It will come to you eventually.

I agree that I am overthinking my story, and more on the negative side. But it is not unfounded, as I know there is something missing in the wall of text I just wrote. However, knowing there is a problem but being unable to fix it puts a burden on my mind. This problem will only perpetuate a negative loop, and eventually, I will lose my desire to write more.

I will try to do the thing I hate the most to overcome this—I will rewrite the entire chapter. Hopefully, it will get better.

You’re not going to know until you get the writing down on paper and in front of people. Your metaphor of the ship isn’t accurate. It’s not like you’re sinking—your supply of the written word is inexhaustible. Getting words out there is only going to strengthen you.

The word is inexhaustible, but my vision is too narrow, and my skill is lacking, turning my ideas into a jumbled mess of words with little to no coherence. As for getting the words out, that is another problem for me in English, of course. My brain doesn’t directly come up with the words, only the context, so I need extra effort to put them together. And most of the time, I forget the words I know when I want to use them.

 

[ShrimpShady]

I think feedback does help a lot, but every other reply has already said that, so I won't harp on it lol. One thing I think is crucial for writers is to become more literate. Read more stories and read more about stories (or watch videos if your attention span is like mine). The more stories and analysis of stories you commit to your brain, the more you'll develop a discerning eye. You'll start knowing what you like, what aspects of a story matter most to you, and how to achieve them. And of course, your English will improve in the process.

 

[Deleted member 192215]

My best bet if you want to know your writing is good or bad. Try to compare your story to many others.

See what are your errors and mistakes on what you did. It is like data analytics.
Some authors might have the same mistakes, that is decide by your brain on how to fix it yourself.

Similar said from the guy above me:

I think feedback does help a lot, but every other reply has already said that, so I won't harp on it lol. One thing I think is crucial for writers is to become more literate. Read more stories and read more about stories (or watch videos if your attention span is like mine). The more stories and analysis of stories you commit to your brain, the more you'll develop a discerning eye. You'll start knowing what you like, what aspects of a story matter most to you, and how to achieve them. And of course, your English will improve in the process.

Just keep on writing. Make sure take a break, and let your brain process the words. Once you are done taking a break, continue your story.

 

[Green_Dolphin]

Okay, I gained many insights from the advices. I realize how lazy I was compared to what I want to achieve. I will return to the basics and restart from there.

And lastly, good luck to everyone.

 

[Fakeminsk]

The best writers are readers. Read, actively and widely, not just within a favourite genre. From bad authors, you can learn what -not- to do. From good ones, emulate. Recent books that had a big influence on me: Stephen King's Billy Summer, Sally Rooney's Normal People. Oh, and I'd recommend King's On Writing--it makes for a great audiobook, he's a good reader. I'm not a fan of 'how to' guides, but his is great.

 

[PancakesWitch]

The best writers are readers. Read, actively and widely, not just within a favourite genre. From bad authors, you can learn what -not- to do. From good ones, emulate. Recent books that had a big influence on me: Stephen King's Billy Summer, Sally Rooney's Normal People. Oh, and I'd recommend King's On Writing--it makes for a great audiobook, he's a good reader. I'm not a fan of 'how to' guides, but his is great.

when you write a lot reading can be pretty boring though, you're seeing words every day for hours, reading more feels like the same, so nowadays i often go for manga, webtoons, anime and video games, rather than reading more... but when i'm writing, in between, i somtimes read random stuff

 

[MarekSusicky]

But I can't tell if what I'm currently writing is good enough

You'll never feel that you are good enough. All you can do is strive to be the best you can in the moment. Commit, write, release. @dukerino is right, learn by doing.

Don't forget: the more eloquent your writing, the worse the result. Simple words, simple sentences, simple structure. You don’t need to prove you own a thesaurus or have thousands of obscure words from top of your head.

 

[Rhaps]

Drugs and alcohol.

 

[AmbreaTaddy]

Being an aspirant writer without any proper literature background and as an ESL speaker, only driven by passion, I found it challenging to improve my skills. I want to learn, but to no avail, as what I gain is only a superficial understanding of it.

I want to ask but have no place to go, want to explore but have nothing to look for.

As for help from internet users, I also want it, but it is hard to find someone who is truly able to teach me what I want (even though I don't know what I want).

So, what do you guys think?

Writing chapters and posting them won’t do any good. Although there is feedback, it can only fill a hole or two but won’t save the ship.

As an ESL writer, I will tell you exactly how I did it :

I read a lot. Like a LOT. Before starting I Blinked and Now I'm Famous, my first webnovel, I spent several whole days reading webnovels, several over 400 chapters. What helps is also to read translated works or ESL authors, because you can directly see how they go arounf the translation issue, and several of them use very simple words and sentence, but still convey an incredible story. Essentially, you don't need to be a god of writing, as long as your story is enjoyable and you convey it well

 

[DorenWinslowe]

Others have already said it, but I will reiterate. Read. Read often. Read works from professional authors, from aspiring writers, and from fanfic authors. See what they do. See how they did it. And then reverse-engineer it for yourself. Don't plagiarize, but definitely learn and adapt to your own needs and style.

 

[DismaiNaim]

I've been writing badly since 2007, writing much better now. Throughout all of my writing "career" I've barely made $100 off my stories. So take whatever I say with that in mind.

1) never EVER argue with a beta reader or a review. If someone posts 1-star because they hate your crap, take it quietly and move on.

2) learn to read through the lines on feedback. "This section is boring" can sometimes be fixed with the addition of one small sentence. "That doesn't make sense" doesn't mean it should, and "it's well-written" is not a compliment.

3) understand the meaning behind the deadly sins—expository, shoehorning, Grandstanding, etc etc.

4) read. A lot. Find other writers to beta read for. This has probably helped me the most bc I could see the problem in other people's writing and identify those same mistakes in my own.

5) ditch the idealistic world and write the most authentic, realistic outcome. Screw the audience's feelings. This character sicks her man-eating lizard on a POW, maybe the Audience won't like that, well tough because that's who she is get over it.

6) focus on the conflict. Even if you have to say it outright, make sure the audience knows WHY they need to read this.

7) good doesn't have to win. Even when good does win, it doesn't have to be good. It's more fun when it isn't, really.

 

[Clo]

ESL here. I have been reading for decades. A lot of it, stories like you can find on ScribbleHub.

If you want to improve, I think you should read really good writing (Ursula Le Guin for instance), but you should also read a ton of bad writing.

Whenever you read something very amateur, and you brain goes "wut?", take the time to study what happened. What did this amateur author do wrong here? How could that be fixed?

Start by recognising when things are broken or weak. Then figure out why. Then try to do better.

And keep writing those chapters. Everyone has thousands of shitty words they got to write first before they can write good. So keep writing bad.

But once you get used to reading other people's work and what they do wrong, return to your own work, and try to judge it with the same critical eye.

 

[BornInAbyss]

Honestly, what helped me the most was just reading a ton. Find authors you love and really dig into their style. Pay attention to how they build sentences, develop characters, and structure their stories.
Also, don't be afraid to experiment and write a lot of crap. Seriously, the more you write, the better you'll get.

 

[D.S.Nate]

Being an aspirant writer without any proper literature background and as an ESL speaker, only driven by passion, I found it challenging to improve my skills. I want to learn, but to no avail, as what I gain is only a superficial understanding of it.

I want to ask but have no place to go, want to explore but have nothing to look for.

As for help from internet users, I also want it, but it is hard to find someone who is truly able to teach me what I want (even though I don't know what I want).

So, what do you guys think?

Writing chapters and posting them won’t do any good. Although there is feedback, it can only fill a hole or two but won’t save the ship.

Just write, and surround yourself with people or books you want to be like or as good as. your journey is your own.