Muh business model.

[istryj]

An idea occurred to me: if you have a novel being published on a site, I am could write bonus chapters for Patreon. Without disrupting the main storyline, I am can add “fanfic-like” side stories for paying subscribers. I’m not well-versed in Patreon, nor in writer business models in general, so I’m asking: how does that sound? Is it a bad idea? Have you come across something like this? Does it work?

 

[AmbreaTaddy]

It's a tricky situation , because you are helping another person make money off your back using your creations. But if you like to do it, go ahead.

Unless you are saying you want to write stories for your own Patreon ? In that case, it's a bad idea because your followers will have to go and read a new story each month to understand the context of your fic, and it may not even be a genre they like.

If your idea is to write for someone elses Patreon, it may be fun but only for a little bonus, a low subscription tier, because all patreons may not read the story or like your writing style (after all, they follow the original author for a reason), but curious ones or people invested in the story could like to have a little bit more to consume. I would say it's an idea for a tier between 1 to 10 $ max.

 

[ThisAdamGuy]

I see two ways you could go about doing this, and I don't think either will work. Either you can work for yourself, essentially asking people for money in exchange for writing fanfiction, which 1. they can already get for free, and 2. is a great way to get your pants sued off by the authors who own the characters and setting. Or you can contact the author and try to work directly with them, but the fact that they're authors at all means they enjoy writing, so I doubt they'd be interested in hiring (and sharing profits with) somebody to write their own story for them.

 

[istryj]

Unless you are saying you want to write stories for your own Patreon ?

Yes, I was talking about my own Patreon. The translator went crazy—in the original text, I didn’t specify who exactly, but I guess you can’t say it that way in English, so it started writing “you” instead of “I.” I tried to fix it manually, but apparently just made things even more confusing. Sorry.

 

[beast_regards]

The web novels are usually subscription services.

The sites like Royal Road, or Scribble Hub, are used as an advertisement of sots, slowly posting the chapters, encouraging the impatient readers to pay for subscription via Patreon where they could the next chapter faster than it is normal, usually some ten or fifteen chapters in advance. Technically, it is not called subscription, but it is how it usually works. That's the usual business model.

You could, of course, monetise your own work in any way you feel is appropriate, but this is how it works for others, and what most people expect.

Either subscription for advanced chapters, or selling the complete books ahead of time.

Selling "fan-fiction" of your own work is technically legal. It's not even fan-fiction, it's adaptation, because, well, you own copyright for your own work (unless you sign it off to others), but the readers who support you on Patreon usually want the original story, not the variation of it. Asking for donation is fair game, but you will get very few takers. Unless your idea is very, very popular.

A term "fan-fiction" is also nebulous. You couldn't sell "fan-fiction" of the works you do not own, that's copyright violation, and you will be sued. Technically, you couldn't even write it for free, that's also copyright violation (but some sites might look away).

 

[CharlesEBrown]

A frequent use of Patreon is for people to post "raw" future chapters - generally as many as five - before posting the edited versions on free or subscription sites.
I have not heard of anyone posting side stories there - more often, you'll see side stories posted on the free sites (essentially used as advertising for the main story) with links to the Patreon for more details.
And a thought I once had was proven to be a bad idea - to have "borderline adult" chapters on a free site and the "full on smut" versions behind a Patreon paywall. People looking for smut either don't want to pay for it, or already did and won't bother looking for alternate versions.

 

[beast_regards]

And a thought I once had was proven to be a bad idea - to have "borderline adult" chapters on a free site and the "full on smut" versions behind a Patreon paywall. People looking for smut either don't want to pay for it, or already did and won't bother looking for alternate versions.

The "read the smut on Patreon" is, as far I could say, exclusively used on the Royal Road because of insane content rules where it is better to fill the chapter with only [CENSORED][CENSORED][CENSORED][CENSORED][CENSORED][CENSORED][CENSORED][CENSORED] and nothing else, than risk everything in the argument with the Moderator John...

This doesn't work very well, considering how reliant you are on the reviews, and keeping your audience at your good side.

 

[istryj]

A frequent use of Patreon is for people to post "raw" future chapters - generally as many as five - before posting the edited versions on free or subscription sites.

great

more often, you'll see side stories posted on the free sites (essentially used as advertising for the main story) with links to the Patreon for more details.

I just decided that those who want more -- should pay. That my idea.

he sites like Royal Road, or Scribble Hub, are used as an advertisement of sots, slowly posting the chapters, encouraging the impatient readers to pay for subscription via Patreon where they could the next chapter faster than it is normal, usually some ten or fifteen chapters in advance.

Got it.

 

[Valmond]

Monetizing FanFiction isn’t legal. If you’re pursued, can’t say what will happen. Always get permission first.

Now, if it is your own story. And you have stuff your fans would like on Patreon, then yeah. You can do that.

 

[beast_regards]

Got it.

The obligatory warning.

Beware Webnovel.com contract.

Contract with Webnovel (Quidian) would prevent you from seeking any monetization elsewhere.

If you sign up with the Webnovel, not only you lose the ownership of your own novel, and you are forbidden from seeking any form of monetization elsewhere on Patreon, of Kofi, or so on. Moment you agree to their contract, they would become owners of your novel, and you would be contracted to write that novel for you. If you fail to keep their demands, they could fire you from your former novel, and assign a different writer to it.

If you, on the other hand, post on Kindle (Amazon), your contract would not strip you down off your ownership of the novel, but it would demand a complete exclusivity for your work. Which means you couldn't post your content elsewhere unless you want to provoke the Amazon legal team. You will be prevented from posting any content elsewhere. This is the route the RR wants you to push to.

TL/DR:

If you sign with Webnovel, the China will own your novel.

If you sign with Kindle (Amazon), you will own your novel, but you could sell it only to Amazon through Amazon. (And MJ will get the share of profits)

 

[Clo]

If you sign with Kindle (Amazon), you will own your novel, but you could sell it only to Amazon through Amazon. (And MJ will get the share of profits)

As far as I know, if you want Kindle Unlimited, which gives users who pay for KU access to your book (great for discovery), you HAVE to give Amazon exclusive distribution.

If you are not intested in KU, still want Amazon distribution, and don't want to stub out of sites like SH or RR, you don't have to give Amazon exclusive rights. You just get a worst cut from each sales (price bracket depending) if you do so.

So it really depends if you care more about money (everybody loves to be able to pay rent and eat food, right?) or if you want to keep giving your story for free.

You can sign up for Amazon, Ebooks, Physical books, audiobooks, and even IngramSpark (and other publishers) all at the same time, as long as you avoid the extended distribution network from Amazon's options.

As far as I know, if you go that route, you technically want IngramSpark to do the extended distribution instead of Amazon, because book stores (like Chapters, Indigo, etc.) won't order from Amazon (as they are competitors), but they will get them from IS, assuming they have a reason to order copies of your novel (For example, if you manage to convince the store owner they should carry your book).

 

[beast_regards]

So it really depends if you care more about money (everybody loves to be able to pay rent and eat food, right?) or if you want to keep giving your story for free.

Even though I am certainly enthusiastic about being able to pay rent, writing is not a job for me.

 

[istryj]

Beware Webnovel.com contract.

It so happened that yesterday I became interested in this site. The monetization format is similar to what’s used on services in Russia and Ukraine, and it really suits me. Where do I sign this contract? I read their Terms of Use, and here’s what they say:

6.1User Content Generally. Certain features of the Service may permit users to upload content to the Service, including original literary works (such as fictions, short stories, essays, etc.), suggestions, messages, comments, reviews, photos, video, images, folders, data, text, and other types of works (“User Content”) and to publish User Content on the Service. You retain copyright and any other proprietary rights that you may hold in the User Content that you post to the Service.

I might be making a mistake, but I’d like to give it a try.

 

[CharlesEBrown]

It so happened that yesterday I became interested in this site. The monetization format is similar to what’s used on services in Russia and Ukraine, and it really suits me. Where do I sign this contract? I read their Terms of Use, and here’s what they say:


I might be making a mistake, but I’d like to give it a try.

Before you do, check the output requirements. Back when I was able to drive and not working, I had a lot of time to write and could probably have met them easily; now, unless they've removed some of the "gotcha" clauses, I probably would lose control of all but one of my stories within a few weeks (that one has about 60 chapters written and will probably hit 200 before ending the first major arc).

 

[beast_regards]

It so happened that yesterday I became interested in this site. The monetization format is similar to what’s used on services in Russia and Ukraine, and it really suits me. Where do I sign this contract? I read their Terms of Use, and here’s what they say:

The Terms of Use differ from the contract they offer ...

They usually contact you on their own once they find out that your story is very likely going to be regularly updated, judging from the frequency of updates. If they are interested, they will send you the proposed contract via their private messaging system on their website, or via the email, then you could contact the legal team, and it's done. The Web novel doesn't particularly care about the copyright of third parties, so the fan fics could get the offer too, due to how the Chinese law works.

Make sure you check the terms when you agree to this. Contract terms are different from terms of service on the site.

If I simplify their terms a little bit:

You agree to provide x amount of content for your story each day. If you keep pumping content, they will pay you the specified amount. There are quotas to fill, and the promised pay. It's not particularly big, and it's different from how they as the site make money. If you fail to fulfil the quota, they will replace you with a different writer who could.

Keep in mind, you couldn't withdraw from the contract. Only way for you to annul the contract once signed is when they fail to pay you, but they could swamp you with quotas long before it happens.

 

[istryj]

each day

 

[beast_regards]

The pace is break neck, yes. The many novels on site are long running Chinese series could be hundred if not thousands of chapters long.