Writing Why does this trope exist?

[Arch9CivilReactor]

I originally wanted to just rant about how Nano Machine, the Murim Manhwa about a martial artist with a cheat-like futuristic enhancement using tech, and how it wasted my time. The first arc about becoming the Heavenly Demon or whatever was good, then spiralled from there.

And the thing that ruined it was that grape scene.

For those who also read it, you know the one.

It makes me curious. I’m unsure what pop culture is like in the area these are written, but most Xianxia aren’t bad before this trope is used. I liked the ‘Against The Gods’ Xianxia even though the main character was a menace.

It’s not like we readers have high moral standards for the MC. Seeing them scheme and be complete jerks to everyone is sometimes fun to watch. The main character of Nano Machine before this grape scene was no Saint. He did some messed up things to his object of revenge and anyone even slightly related to his mother’s death.

It makes me wonder… Why go this far? Some say the whole “Yin Physique gets cured by Yang Body” is the problem, but even Manhwa with similar MCs to this use some sort of spiritual absorption rather than saying “You gotta get it on with her unconscious body to cure her”.

No, even that isn’t the problem.

The main character before this moment had:

1. Realised that having too many partners can lead to the same tragedy as his mother.

2. Has OP nano machines that do anything.

The scene in question is written to make the main character say “I cannot avoid this outcome” and “there is nothing I can do to stop this from happening and reap benefits”. Acting like he is doing some great sacrifice on his end.

This MoFo… He had damn nano machines. He has treated people with incurable conditions before with no problem at all. Why is it NOW his nano machines are like “Nah, can’t heal that condition” and making him ‘force himself’?

Moreover, this is a power fantasy about gaining nano machines in a Murim world. What kind of power fantasy forces the main character to have no choice? I just don’t believe it. It sounds too nonsensical. No way his cheat was useless.

Guess you can say authors would even strain the suspension of belief to get this trope added.

Why?

There is no inherent benefit or ‘power’ in the scene itself. It’s the MC doing the exact opposite of what he was doing this entire time. He’s just abiding by the rules of the setting, which is the most powerless thing a powerful MC can do.

I’m unsure what to make of this.

Why do so many eastern authors add this trope?

 

[Zagaroth]

It's some form of misogyny, that much is clear. The exact reasoning behind it? I don't know, I don't get it.

I mean, there is some eroticism in a slightly contested sex scene, but we're talking more about two people competing to see who is on top.

Or maybe a scenario where she wants to make him push boundaries, she has an 'escape button' of some sort that they both know about, and very clearly doesn't try to use it.

But true non-con is a no-go to begin with, and unconscious is just ... not sexy? the term 'dead fish' exists for a reason.

Passion people, Passion! If you don't want a partner who is engaged, go get a f'ing blow up doll and leave real people alone. Just don't write about it. I don't want to know that you prefer dead dolls to living people.

 

[Arch9CivilReactor]

It's some form of misogyny, that much is clear. The exact reasoning behind it? I don't know, I don't get it.

I mean, there is some eroticism in a slightly contested sex scene, but we're talking more about two people competing to see who is on top.

Or maybe a scenario where she wants to make him push boundaries, she has an 'escape button' of some sort that they both know about, and very clearly doesn't try to use it.

But true non-con is a no-go to begin with, and unconscious is just ... not sexy? the term 'dead fish' exists for a reason.

Passion people, Passion! If you don't want a partner who is engaged, go get a f'ing blow up doll and leave real people alone. Just don't write about it. I don't want to know that you prefer dead dolls to living people.

Or the almighty right hand. lol

 

[Arch9CivilReactor]

You signed off for Xiaxia and you complain about getting the average experience from a Xiaxia? "If it isn't the consequences of my own actions"

I beg to differ... Nonsensical world, nonsensical powers, non existing characters. Everyone is one and the same and the only reason the mc usually is a genius is because everyone else is a complete idiot to the point where I don't even want to compare them with autistic people because I find it disrespectful even for them.


I am confident that this is still a massive problem. I get what you are trying to say, because doing so is opposite to the characters goals, motivations, etc. But actually, in such a world raping is the most logical out of every bullshit the authors write.

As for why the author wrote it, come on.... you know the reason... lets not pretend we are pure.

There are sexier smut in the world. The point is that, like you accurately pointed out, it goes against everything they stand for. Even murder hobos at least live in their power fantasy. This “it is the only way” nonsense is just un-sexy.

grape is never incentivised because people have to make justification. No one wants to be the bad guy. Even if it does happen, it’s done by the absolute worst villains who will die as fodder very soon. Also I feel like you’re making the trash people write for views (because it’s somehow become a job now). The kind of Xianxia that are good as ‘reading if you are bored’, but not to be invested.

There are many good Xianxia out there, but I get where you’re coming from about the average quality in most non-translated and even some translated works.

Anyway, it just isn’t sexy or appealing to have the MC the author built up as a badass to turn into a helpless/pathetic cuck that’s so against the boning, but will fo it anyway. It’s just character assassination at its finest.

 

[Nolff]

There are sexier smut in the world. The point is that, like you accurately pointed out, it goes against everything they stand for. Even murder hobos at least live in their power fantasy. This “it is the only way” nonsense is just un-sexy.

grape is never incentivised because people have to make justification. No one wants to be the bad guy. Even if it does happen, it’s done by the absolute worst villains who will die as fodder very soon. Also I feel like you’re making the trash people write for views (because it’s somehow become a job now). The kind of Xianxia that are good as ‘reading if you are bored’, but not to be invested.

There are many good Xianxia out there, but I get where you’re coming from about the average quality in most non-translated and even some translated works.

Anyway, it just isn’t sexy or appealing to have the MC the author built up as a badass to turn into a helpless/pathetic cuck that’s so against the boning, but will fo it anyway. It’s just character assassination at its finest.

Relax, my friend. At some point, authors tend to make mistakes. The guy's probably still under pressure or such.

 

[LoneQuack]

There are sexier smut in the world. The point is that, like you accurately pointed out, it goes against everything they stand for. Even murder hobos at least live in their power fantasy. This “it is the only way” nonsense is just un-sexy.

grape is never incentivised because people have to make justification. No one wants to be the bad guy. Even if it does happen, it’s done by the absolute worst villains who will die as fodder very soon. Also I feel like you’re making the trash people write for views (because it’s somehow become a job now). The kind of Xianxia that are good as ‘reading if you are bored’, but not to be invested.

There are many good Xianxia out there, but I get where you’re coming from about the average quality in most non-translated and even some translated works.

Anyway, it just isn’t sexy or appealing to have the MC the author built up as a badass to turn into a helpless/pathetic cuck that’s so against the boning, but will fo it anyway. It’s just character assassination at its finest.

Can't argue with with character assassination part, I find you spot on. All I will say is that if you base for rating something good is "reading if you are bored" then its a bad book.

 

[corruption]

It is just an excuse to have the MC rape a woman, and justify it.
Let me guess, everyone is "oh, he saved her life so he's a hero, and she should be grateful to be abused." instead of saying "Why couldn't he heal her like he did others? Convenient time for the nanos to cut out. Too convenient."
And let me take another guess, she wasn't interested in him, but rather hated him, but afterwards she gets feeling for him. Maybe 'justified' by some connection caused by the 'sharing of energies'
I haven't seen it, but I can see this happening.

Can't have too many partners? Well, guess that means she's stuck taking care of him to prevent that, now doesn't it?

 

[Nolff]

It is just an excuse to have the MC rape a woman, and justify it.
Let me guess, everyone is "oh, he saved her life so he's a hero, and she should be grateful to be abused." instead of saying "Why couldn't he heal her like he did others? Convenient time for the nanos to cut out. Too convenient."
And let me take another guess, she wasn't interested in him, but rather hated him, but afterwards she gets feeling for him. Maybe 'justified' by some connection caused by the 'sharing of energies'
I haven't seen it, but I can see this happening.

Can't have too many partners? Well, guess that means she's stuck taking care of him to prevent that, now doesn't it?

One of the main reason I hate harems - This thing.

Best harem IMO:

 

[RepresentingWrath]

The same reason there are rape scenes in majority of works targeted at older women.

 

[greyblob]

The scene in question is written to make the main character say “I cannot avoid this outcome” and “there is nothing I can do to stop this from happening and reap benefits”.

if he doesn't, he's gay

 

[corruption]

if he doesn't, he's gay

Do you really think they won't make one where a gay guy has to rape a woman, and does it?
I can see them doing that as a way for him to take responsibility for any kid they have and enter a relationship with her

 

[cabbag3]

The same reason there are rape scenes in majority of works targeted at older women.

Best duo

 

[Arch9CivilReactor]

Do you really think they won't make one where a gay guy has to rape a woman, and does it?
I can see them doing that as a way for him to take responsibility for any kid they have and enter a relationship with her

Sounds like ‘Against the Gods’. She says no the entire time but he wants to take responsibility for her child afterwards (when her life got ruined because of his ‘saving’). Note: She was saying she would rather die than go through with his saving method beforehand.

I call him gay since he doesn’t at all sound straight when he’s ‘romancing’. Sounds like a gay guy forcing himself to look straight because he doesn’t understand women. (He declares wanting a harem early on but only has one-liners to provide them. Pay the damn child support!)

One of the main reason I hate harems - This thing.

Best harem IMO:

The only Harem main character guy readers swoon over. Basically if Tadano from Komi can’t communicate was a harem master.

 

[OokamiKasumi]

The same reason there are rape scenes in majority of works targeted at older women.

Nope. Us older women despise rape in all its forms.
-- Rape is a Male fantasy, not a Female fantasy -- especially in the far East.

 

[CharlesEBrown]

Nope. Us older women despise rape in all its forms.
-- Rape is a Male fantasy, not a Female fantasy -- especially in the far East.

I have met exactly one woman who had rape fantasies (as opposed to nightmares), and I believe she was a 30-something but it's been a few years. Have also met three guys at wildly different ages who admitted to fantasies of raping women.
And about five women who admit to having been raped and ... well, their stories make me think verifiable, serial rape or rape of a minor should be a capitol offense.

 

[HungrySheep]

There's nothing I can do to stop this trope from perpetuating. It's completely out of my hands. This wretched fate of mine, these powerless fingers which grip at the firmament yet fail to grasp the Heavens themselves. Should the Gods shatter my soul, I could not even be content with such a punishment. Yet I must—for the readers devour it like apes to grapes.

In all seriousness though, the authors are likely simply prioritizing what makes money. The readers vote with their spirit stones or whatever the hell the currency on Qidian is. Tropes recur because readers clamor for them.

 

[Arch9CivilReactor]

There's nothing I can do to stop this trope from perpetuating. It's completely out of my hands. This wretched fate of mine, these powerless fingers which grip at the firmament yet fail to grasp the Heavens themselves. Should the Gods shatter my soul, I could not even be content with such a punishment. Yet I must—for the readers devour it like apes to grapes.

In all seriousness though, the authors are likely simply prioritizing what makes money. The readers vote with their spirit stones or whatever the hell the currency on Qidian is. Tropes recur because readers clamor for them.

Translated works are often due to a different eastern site that loves the same kind of mindset as Qidian.

 

[Kenjona]

And this ugly trope rears it ugly head again. Yep, its so a man can force himself on a woman of good breeding in the name of helping her and get away with said rape, because it is for a good deed. Usually sometime after he blew off all the beautiful thots who were willing to be his bed toy.

It is a sad trope centered around the Patriarchal traditions based on Confucian ideas advocating that a woman's duty was to her husband>family>household, anything more was extra to these responsibilities.

Single women were expected to remain chaste and pure virgins until marriage, anything less than that she was considered dirty. Even dying before being "dishonored" was considered the only correct answer if it was going to happen and even the only answer after being "dishonored" to maintain the families honor.

It is right up there with the trope of if a Man banged her, he bought/owned her or she was worth less than trash. In my opinion, just worse due to nonconsensual nature of the trope.

 

[corruption]

Sounds like ‘Against the Gods’. She says no the entire time but he wants to take responsibility for her child afterwards (when her life got ruined because of his ‘saving’). Note: She was saying she would rather die than go through with his saving method beforehand.

I call him gay since he doesn’t at all sound straight when he’s ‘romancing’. Sounds like a gay guy forcing himself to look straight because he doesn’t understand women. (He declares wanting a harem early on but only has one-liners to provide them. Pay the damn child support!)

. . . I was taking a guess based on how horrible people are.
I fear what the fanfics of that would be like.

I have met exactly one woman who had rape fantasies (as opposed to nightmares), and I believe she was a 30-something but it's been a few years. Have also met three guys at wildly different ages who admitted to fantasies of raping women.
And about five women who admit to having been raped and ... well, their stories make me think verifiable, serial rape or rape of a minor should be a capitol offense.

Then this will make you feel better: in some prison systems around the world it is. Plus they add in torture and all other kinds of nasties. No, I am not talking about officially either.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

Nope. Us older women despise rape in all its forms.
-- Rape is a Male fantasy, not a Female fantasy -- especially in the far East.

Well, ackhchually, male fantasy is to eat genderfluid children and opress women, not rape them. I am a man, so I know better.