F%@~ing Tournament arcs!

[Deleted member 84247]

Long post go brrrrr.

 

[D.S.Nate]

Long post go brrrrr.

I wish I could say I did to to rebel against short attention spans or to tick people off but I honestly just pasted this here after writing this for another project.

In any case, thanks for the replay

 

[Deleted member 84247]

I wish I could say I did to yo rebel against short attention spans or to tick people off but I honestly just pasted this here after writing this for another project.

In any case, thanks for the replay

I think it's mostly the formatting of it. Essay type writing isn't known for hooking people in.

 

[BearlyAlive]

TL;DR but I agree. Tournament arcs, if done right, can be pretty good ways of storytelling. But only if done right...

I personally hate tournament arcs almost as much as I hate sports in general (which is a lot, btw). I can see where and why they have their places, but I hate it whenever they appear. They're too predictable, take the focus away from the "main" main story, the pacing is dictated by the tournament instead of the characters, and they almost always end in one of two ways: Either the Main Character wins by besting his "rival" or the "villain" in the finals or semi-finals or the MC loses to his "rival" or "villain" in the finals but learns some new OP bullshit abilities through the power of friendship or whatever that make them multiple times stronger than they were before.

Even the "unpredictable" disruptions during a tournament arc follow a predictable formula: MC or Main Party get provoked before or after the start of the tournament and maybe get coaxed into a bet or some other """unpredictable""" gamble:

• If the MC or MC party are too strong, they get sabotaged or someone tries to force them to yield.
• If they aren't strong enough, they get some outside help from a "randomly passing by Master of whatever they're currently lacking" and use this newly acquired power to win
• During downtime "unpredictable" things might happen that cause one or more characters to be late for their fight which either causes the fight to start with a disadvantage or might to outright losing. They always get in just in time, tho.
• One or more enemy characters are bending the rules to their favor, but they get caught or lose anyway.
• The reason MC is tournamenting gets stolen during or after the tournament for more "unpredictability"

And that's just the first few league arcs of Pokemon before it got predictable because it always happened...

 

[Succubiome]

I find it interesting that everyone is like "there's maybe some good bits in there, but it goes on too long and I don't really want to read the entire thing", because that's how I feel about tournament arcs in general, and usually bounce when I hit one in a story, or soon after. So it feels like a good metaphor.

But by the same token, people who didn't like the essay format: you know you don't have to read/interact with something if you find the format boring, right? Kinda weird to me that this became more about the format than the actual topic.

 

[D.S.Nate]

TL;DR but I agree. Tournament arcs, if done right, can be pretty good ways of storytelling. But only if done right...

I personally hate tournament arcs almost as much as I hate sports in general (which is a lot, btw). I can see where and why they have their places, but I hate it whenever they appear. They're too predictable, take the focus away from the "main" main story, the pacing is dictated by the tournament instead of the characters, and they almost always end in one of two ways: Either the Main Character wins by besting his "rival" or the "villain" in the finals or semi-finals or the MC loses to his "rival" or "villain" in the finals but learns some new OP bullshit abilities through the power of friendship or whatever that make them multiple times stronger than they were before.

Even the "unpredictable" disruptions during a tournament arc follow a predictable formula: MC or Main Party get provoked before or after the start of the tournament and maybe get coaxed into a bet or some other """unpredictable""" gamble:

• If the MC or MC party are too strong, they get sabotaged or someone tries to force them to yield.
• If they aren't strong enough, they get some outside help from a "randomly passing by Master of whatever they're currently lacking" and use this newly acquired power to win
• During downtime "unpredictable" things might happen that cause one or more characters to be late for their fight which either causes the fight to start with a disadvantage or might to outright losing. They always get in just in time, tho.
• One or more enemy characters are bending the rules to their favor, but they get caught or lose anyway.
• The reason MC is tournamenting gets stolen during or after the tournament for more "unpredictability"

And that's just the first few league arcs of Pokemon before it got predictable because it always happened...

This is a really good point. Me personally I'd say I can only take so much of it in a show before I bow out for those same reasons which is why for me at least it comes down the length. When doing research on this for my book I took all the aspects I did not like about the trope and tried to work them in a way I think works better. Not written the arc it happen in yet but I guess we will see when I get there how that goes.

I find it interesting that everyone is like "there's maybe some good bits in there, but it goes on too long and I don't really want to read the entire thing", because that's how I feel about tournament arcs in general, and usually bounce when I hit one in a story, or soon after. So it feels like a good metaphor.

But by the same token, people who didn't like the essay format: you know you don't have to read/interact with something if you find the format boring, right? Kinda weird to me that this became more about the format than the actual topic.

Yeah lol, this whole thing had been very interesting for me for this very reason. I totally understand the unwilling's to read it tho.

 

[Premier]

I'm due for one but I'm going to break it up so each "Round" takes place in a different arena, so there are gaps between each one for other plot. Maybe it'll work out, maybe it'll be an even worse disaster we'll see.

 

[Deleted member 54065]

I always do away with the cliches, and purposefully subvert the tropes in an attempt to write a fresh take on the original concept.

One that ticks me off in battle-themed stories is the tournament arc, which I avoided writing in my own work. Pretty much the same in my isekai story, in which I threw away the ideas of Adventurers Guilds, game-like skill progressions, and OP characters.

 

[CrimsonGenius]

Yugioh is literally tournament the anime.

 

[D.S.Nate]

I'm due for one but I'm going to break it up so each "Round" takes place in a different arena, so there are gaps between each one for other plot. Maybe it'll work out, maybe it'll be an even worse disaster we'll see.

It really depends on what it's being broken up with and if that new thing feels different from what came before. Ideally, I'd say you want to both give a feel progression of the plot and a shake up to how to take the next step from then on. Like if the first round of a tournament is a free for all then the next stage could be a team made up with the ones who survived, that then ends with the top 8 having 1 v 1's. This is a simple example and if you can think of more ways to change the vibe of each round then go for it.

 

[Premier]

It really depends on what it's being broken up with and if that new thing feels different from what came before. Ideally, I'd say you want to both give a feel progression of the plot and a shake up to how to take the next step from then on. Like if the first round of a tournament is a free for all then the next stage could be a team made up with the ones who survived, that then ends with the top 8 having 1 v 1's. This is a simple example and if you can think of more ways to change the vibe of each round then go for it.

The plan is you have one round, then travel to the next place to do the next round while all the plot continues. Gives time for planning, learning new skills and all that.