Tell not show

[Kilolo]

you know what the part that exasperate me?
that people actually assuming that shows means wrote the whole thing as a wall of text and tell means writing it in a direct sentence.

the former isn't called show, it's a thorough describing, and the later isn't called tell either, it's just a brief sentence

what it means by show not tell, is deliberately giving a gaping, yet obvious information about something.

the most common example I often read: in a novel with system/game elements with stat point and such. lots of author put the exact number of how many points the MC allocate to their stats. and then giving out an exact number without telling the reader how strong is 23 point in STR is.

meanwhile some of higher rated LN out there with system/game elements. they rarely specify how much point the mc allocate to each stat. (except maybe some korean WN). most of them just wrote something like "I used to be able to split a rock with a size of a dog house, but after I allocate some of the point to the strength, I can now split a boulder with a size of a carriage."
they didn't tell the reader how many points that MC allocate to the strength, or how many point mc str is currently at. but we can tell that he's becoming stronger now.

it's not about the length or the amount of information, it's about what you wrote to describe things.

 

[greyblob]

show when you need to show - tell when you don't need to show. simple as

 

[Discount_Blade]

It's really sad, considering how the fun part of exploring a new world is being slowly fed information and using said information to draw conclusions to varying degrees of success.

I contend that literary quality is taking a nosedive with Gen Z because they have absolutely no patience. And yes I'm doing the generational thing because it is them and anyone denying it is a liar or in denial because I hurt your feelings. Don't care btw.

They want explosions, they want fights, they want flashing lights, but aren't willing to wait for the buildup. I feel like a lot of people who say Show, don't tell, are full of shit because that's not what they truly mean, or at least not what they truly want. They want brief (if any) description, coupled with fast-paced narrative, bonus points for gratuitous sex, frequent battles, etc. etc.

I've seen people lose their minds on slow stories, bitching about "nothing happened" because a scene progressed slowly to build suspense. No one complained about a chapter in a story that had so little description, you couldn't tell what anyone looked like, maybe you knew the MC's hair color? Maybe? The world was a big blank because nothing but maybe the name of the village or town was described. Perhaps it might be sunny? Maybe? Idk, author didn't really say. Nope, all I would know is MC just one-shotted some asshole with a magic bullet and his companion is a sexy lady with big tits, and a round ass. That's all. But guess what? No one is bitching about that huh?

Readers are usually like drug-addicted monkeys. They toss feces when they feel like their fix isn't being catered to, but give them too much of it and they still aren't any happier than before. Don't give them enough and they'll smear you in the worst possible way they can.

I mean, I spent a paragraph, (Just a paragraph guys), describing the grassy plains, the moonlit night, and I tossed in some details about a horse drawn carriage approaching from the distance. A paragraph. 4 sentences. And someone left a comment saying I was too wordy.

I just ignore these people nowadays. Don't like descriptions or detailed writing? Piss right off then. This isn't SpikeTV.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

I contend that literary quality is taking a nosedive with Gen Z because they have absolutely no patience. And yes I'm doing the generational thing because it is them and anyone denying it is a liar or in denial because I hurt your feelings. Don't care btw.

I'm not trying to pick a fight, but those who exploit this are just as bad, no? Just to make things clear, I'm not red, nor do I think that capitalism is bad.

 

[greyblob]

No one complained about a chapter in a story that had so little description

I got a few of those early on actually.

 

[Discount_Blade]

, I'm not red

Weird response. To me, being blue is the insult, not red. Most people I'm talking to (potentially insulting )are most likely blue.

I got a few of those early on actually.

Never seen this. I wish I had your issues when I still wrote, not the twats I got.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

Weird response. To me, being blue is the insult, not red.

In my country, communists are still red.

 

[greyblob]

Never seen this. I wish I had your issues when I still wrote, not the twats I got.

well my issues were writing too little descriptions. I don't think you'd want that

 

[Discount_Blade]

In my country, communists are still red.

So the reverse to in America then. Most of those types are blue here.

well my issues were writing too little descriptions. I don't think you'd want that

Ah, nevermind. The opposite of me. I misunderstood.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

Ah, so the reverse to in America then.

Yeah, also, to add to your topic. I'm not a native English speaker, and it's hard to write a long description. I, honestly, would love to, but sometimes, I really can't translate something, and I can't spend hours asking around how people call this little piece of a car(example). And whenever I see my own generic descriptions, I feel sad and want to delete them altogether. I think of describing this and that. I'm thinking of using metaphors, I envision the scene, but it's fucking hard. Even all the dictionaries and asking around on forums won't always help. I think some people are like me. Maybe it's a minority, but still, it's better than nothing. As for big titty girls, describing humans are somewhat simple, not their clothes tho...

 

[Discount_Blade]

Yeah, also, to add to your topic. I'm not a native English speaker, and it's hard to write a long description. I, honestly, would love to, but sometimes, I really can't translate something, and I can't spend hours asking around how people call this little piece of a car(example). And whenever I see my own generic descriptions, I feel sad and want to delete them altogether. I think of describing this and that. I'm thinking of using metaphors, I envision the scene, but it's fucking hard. Even all the dictionaries and asking around on forums won't always help. I think some people are like me. Maybe it's a minority, but still, it's better than nothing. As for big titty girls, describing humans are somewhat simple, not their clothes tho...

You misunderstand. I was speaking against people complaining about "too much detail", also usually being fans of the ":show don't tell" advice. Main reason I discredit and ignore anyone who says it.

 

[RepresentingWrath]

You misunderstand. I was speaking against people complaining about "too much detail", also usually being the same ":show don't tell".

Ohh, sorry, my bad.

 

[TheHelpfulFawn]

Ai-chan thinks Agatha Christie had it right. Start the book with a heavy description, then quickly go to the meat of the story. Don't linger in any one scene too long or give too many details, leave the details for only the things that matter. Get in, describe the scene, get out. Use as few distractions as possible.

Pretty much this. Sometimes, authors tend to repeat details several times, but in different ways to add depth or perspective. It's repetitive I say. Describe what is important in the scene, sprinkle key details to the plot here and there, and move on with the story.

 

[Irl_Rat]

I contend that literary quality is taking a nosedive with Gen Z because they have absolutely no patience. And yes I'm doing the generational thing because it is them and anyone denying it is a liar or in denial because I hurt your feelings. Don't care btw.

Sure it's a generalization, but one I'm more than incline to agree with.

A bunch of my friends complain about HxH, Fullmetal alchemist, and Steins Gate because "hurr durr nothing happen." The guys want big booba and action scene while the girls talk way too much about which male character they think is a husbando. Sure there's nothing wrong with enjoying those aspects, I just get annoyed that I have less people to talk to when it comes to slower stuff.

 

[Discount_Blade]

Sure it's a generalization, but one I'm more than incline to agree with.

A bunch of my friends complain about HxH, Fullmetal alchemist, and Steins Gate because "hurr durr nothing happen." The guys want big booba and action scene while the girls talk way too much about which male character they think is a husbando. Sure there's nothing wrong with enjoying those aspects, I just get annoyed that I have less people to talk to when it comes to slower stuff.

The fact that they complained about Full Metal Alchemist (specifically Brotherhood and not that terrible first series) to me, just justifies my point.

 

[Agentt]

The monogatari experience.

It's really sad, considering how the fun part of exploring a new world is being slowly fed information and using said information to draw conclusions to varying degrees of success.

Hey, another Monogatari book series enjoyer.

Hey! I love Monotogatari too! It's definitely the most uniquely written thing ever

 

[AliceShiki]

you know what the part that exasperate me?
that people actually assuming that shows means wrote the whole thing as a wall of text and tell means writing it in a direct sentence.

the former isn't called show, it's a thorough describing, and the later isn't called tell either, it's just a brief sentence

what it means by show not tell, is deliberately giving a gaping, yet obvious information about something.

the most common example I often read: in a novel with system/game elements with stat point and such. lots of author put the exact number of how many points the MC allocate to their stats. and then giving out an exact number without telling the reader how strong is 23 point in STR is.

meanwhile some of higher rated LN out there with system/game elements. they rarely specify how much point the mc allocate to each stat. (except maybe some korean WN). most of them just wrote something like "I used to be able to split a rock with a size of a dog house, but after I allocate some of the point to the strength, I can now split a boulder with a size of a carriage."
they didn't tell the reader how many points that MC allocate to the strength, or how many point mc str is currently at. but we can tell that he's becoming stronger now.

it's not about the length or the amount of information, it's about what you wrote to describe things.

Yeah, this baffles me for sure. Especially because telling to me often times involves lengthier blocks of text actually.

Like, telling, is to have the newly-rescued princess tell the MC about how he is now in trouble, because of the horrible people from the neighboring country have a 500 years long grudge against her country due to the food competition that they lost and about how this led to countless wars and how they'll chase the princess to the ends of the world in order to take their revenge.

Showing, is having the princess being worried and scared even after being rescued, and then having the MC being attacked by people from the neighboring country not long after the princess was rescued... And at that point, you can highlight how she became even more terrified than before once she did see the people she feared come and stuff.

To me, "Show not tell" in writing, is primarily like... "Don't write exposition dumps to your readers. They're absolutely unnecessary. Just like... Show the things your MC need to know and that will be that."

 

[Racosharko]

Which one of these fit better in this scenario?

I walked to the academy as fast as I could.
Or~~

I walked down the stairs, filled with enthusiasm and excitement for the new day. A new life even. Sun shone brightly and the skies were clear, a beautiful hue of blue, deep and mesmerising. Every step I take reminds me that this isn't a dream, and I simply couldn't help but giggle at fate.

It was still about half an hour before the lessons start, but I wanted to go there early just in case.

In between of the garden, I saw the old gardener, Simon hunched on his back. It was still spring, so the patch was barren other than the few sproutings here and there.
"Hello there uncle," I waved at him with a gleeful smile.
He turned around, and was equally happy to see me, "Oh! MC kun, how nice to see you. Isn't it too early though?"
Uncle Simon was a man in his forties, but he was still in incredible shape, with a body that could surely tear down a tree without needing an axe.
He was wearing a white tank top, which had started to become yellow, and wore blue jorts, shabbily made. Knowing uncle Simon, he probably tore the cloth with his own hands, finding using scissors to be too troublesome.
"Ah, yes, but I was actually to excited to stay in my room, so..."
My voice trailed at the end, but it seemed uncle Simon understood,
"It really is nice to be young. You remind me of my first visit to my in laws. I was too nervous to even sleep. Kept tossing and turning the entire time."

-To be continued

That is not a good example of the difference between show and tell

purpose: MC is moving quickly

Tell reader MC is moving fast:
"I walked to the academy as fast as I could."

Show reader MC is moving fast:
"I move briskly down the corridor diving and dodging between gaps of slower walking people."

The same thing is done but with different methods. One tells the other shows.

 

[lnv]

Soo....
Show, not tell

Is a famous tip to give to people here.
Like, everyone knows it, if they don't, we have plenty of people to inform them of this marvelous fact.

It's almost the basic foundation of any screenwriting.

The thing is, at first we learn the basics, that would be language, grammar and other basic techniques, including show, not tell. But that is only the basics, once you get to the point where you write your own novel, all the english rules we hear about go out the window. There is nothing wrong with making up words, or making up your own grammar either. But there is a big difference between doing so when you don't know the basics, and doing so when you do.

Think of it like swordsmanship, everyone starts learning the basics. Only after you get the basics down, can you make up your own style. And at that moment, there is no right or wrong. Whoever wins is right. But you can't just skip to making up your own style without learning the basics first. Writing is the same.

It's always up to the author to decide when they wish to "show" something, or when they wish to "tell" something. Because it is up to the author to decide what kind of story they wish the reader to be immersed in. This is why even in plays, they have the narrator that tells, and the play that shows. By combining the two skillfully, like any tool in an author's disposal, you can set the mood of your story and that contributes to the enjoyment of the readers. If you focus too much on just showing, it can distract your readers from the actual story one wishes to portray. I mean we have all seen it, stories where authors get so hooked on showing that we go "Oh right, that thing was the plot! I forgot all about it"

So show what needs to be showed, and tell what needs to be told. Even Info dumps aren't bad if used properly. If you can spend a few paragraphs to not write a dozen chapters of useless boring content, then even if it may cause momentary displeasure to readers, they will appreciate it in the long run. Writing is all about the ups and downs, not every sentence needs to be chiseled in gold(unless it's a classic like invisible dragon). The low points contribute to the build up of the high points. And that is what has the most return.

Long story short, FORGET EVERY RULE, write what you feel is right. Just make sure you know what you are doing.

 

[Agentt]

That is not a good example of the difference between show and tell

purpose: MC is moving quickly

Tell reader MC is moving fast:
"I walked to the academy as fast as I could."

Show reader MC is moving fast:
"I move briskly down the corridor diving and dodging between gaps of slower walking people."

The same thing is done but with different methods. One tells the other shows.

Orz, but this thread is pointed towards people who dwell too much into show, and not enough tell.