What is conciousness.

[hauntedwritings]

Well, this is kinda philosophical - am I still I when I wake up?
I certainly can not answer that question. We will have to burrow too deep into the concept of I itself, which is out of my comfort zone.

To me, a human being is not just a specific configuration of particles or substances. These are just a medium. The movement of chemical substances and electrical signals aids in generating the psyche, but the result is stable. Most likely, this is related to memory. And the memory has a physical substrate in the brain.

The brain activity leads to changes in the synaptic connections between some of the neurons. Imagine building a city. When you learn something new that stays in the form of a deeply rooted memory, a new street or alley is constructed in your brain. Later travelling that new path will bring back the memory. Of course, this is something I have read about long-term memories. I am not so sure about the short-term memory, but there should be ways for its preservation before it is forgotten or engraved in the form of a long-term memory path.

Anyway, I think these personal changes to the brain structure, combined with the storm of current activity generated by the movement of substances and signals make you yourself.

By the way, the state of sleeping is not like you shut down a computer. The computer is still working in the background. There are two types of sleep REM and non-REM, and REM sleep shows activity similar to the state of being awake. Therefore it is best to think of this as a continuous operation and not something temporary switched on and off. REM sleep is related to memorizing, while non-REM is related to the real rest period. It shouldn't be all that different from you daydreaming and not paying attention in class. Yet you are still you even when you are distracted and don't pay attention to the stimuli around you.

About the travelling process: The cells don't move in different parts of the brain. It is a relay. Receptors can generate a signal because of a stimuli over a certain threshold. Then that signal is transported thanks to the polarisation of cell membranes. This process is regulated by ion transport and ion gradients across the membrane. When the signal needs to jump from one cell to another, it is converted from electrical to chemical (this is the so-called chemical synapse, bruh there are electrical synapses as well but nvm that now). By travelling over this long path the signal is modified. Well, that's it basically. Very basically...

Ah, just about the plants: it is not really a decision making, it is an innate behavioural response - answer to certain stimuli. It includes taxis, tropism, etc.

Aye. But isn't our own neural activity also an innate behavioral response? Isn't every neuron firing in our brain doing so, as a response to certain stimuli? The only thing that differs is the biological structures, and what kind of stimuli we respond to, and how complex the chain of response is, no?

The question of conciousness indeed becomes philosopical quickly. And it all comes down to where you choose draw the definition, which we haven't done yet. Until that is done by the scientific community, we can merely speculate where to draw the line.

Like the question with am I still I when I wake up. We're not the people we were 10 years ago. People change with time, and there too you can ask yourself where you draw the line between when you become a different person to who you were. Are you still the same person you were before as after reading this post?

 

[CrusadeAgainstFurries]

Btw is it good that I completed my magic system for my story by reading @CrusadeAgainstFurries's post?

"Take what you can, give nothing back" - that's the pirate way

 

[AryaX]

Behind all the mystery mongering, magical thinking, dogmatism, etc... The "Hardness" of the "Hard" Problem of Consciousness, derives ~100% from trying to explain "experience", while simultaneously denying (Explicitly or Implicitly) the existence of any actual "experiencer".

And "Free Will" is likely at least part of the problem... You want to imagine yourself as being the Author of your own Destiny, and to acquire this illusion of power, you try to internalize the control system (the brain) into your "Self"... But when you do that, you're replacing the actual indivisible Self, with the concept of the "Self as a System"... But a "System" is actually number of things, merely conceptualized as "One" thing... There is no "itself" to a System, that could exist as a "subject" and be acted upon...

The simple truth of Consciousness is that it is Simply a One, indivisible part of a system, subject to an "delusional" experience of Being that System...

And the magical "Experience" is simply a different word for the rather mundane thing there is for every action...

You know... Equal and opposite and all that...

 

[Deleted member 29316]

The brain generates a new person when you wake up.

Technically it is. When you sleep, your body generates new cells and 'repair' you. The moment you open your eyes, it's a new person, as well as a new day.

 

[RepresentingCaution]

This reminds me of this book:

Amazon.com

 

[BenJepheneT]

To me, I believe consciousness doesn't just stop at the time we shut our eyes and brains and go to sleep. As proven, our bodies are always working even when under deep ass fucking sleep. No matter if you're resting after a football match or pissing into a pipe under heavy coma, your body is constantly repairing something and maintaining everything.

It might be stupid coming from me but I believe people conflate consciousness with memories a little too much. We humans are so dependant on our cognitive abilities that we'll instantly pivot all of our understanding of the self towards the time when we're awake. We'll doubt scientific papers and theories with over dozens of pages' worth of information but unequivocally trust whatever it is that we see. Your red will forever be your red, and there's nothing that can convince you otherwise. Hell, sometimes we even attempt to "heal" those that don't share the same perspectives, and give them silly names like "schizophrenia".

No, I'm not excusing schizophrenia, but I am posing an possibility. Consciousness is such a widespread term that it's impossible to pin down just what the fuck it is. Is it a memory? Is it the act of neurons firing. (I think they're the same thing.) If so, is Alzheimer's the act of losing consciousness? Is consciousness only counted by the moment, and not from recalling passing events? Is it the state of our bodies working? Is it the same thing as being alive? If we die, do it it consciousnesses go with it? Do our consciousness even transcend death?

We can admire brain patterns and human behaviour all we want but the fact of the matter is that we aren't even sure if consciousness comes from the brain. Hell, we haven't even SCRATCHED the surface of what the brain's truly capable of yet. Consciousness could be stored in the balls for all we fucking know.

For now, I'm willing to bet in what I personally perceive, despite what I've said. Of course, I'll put a deposit of doubt on the side but for now, I think consciousness goes beyond our perception of now and before. "I think, therefore I am" is cool and all but I truly believe that there's something more to consciousness than simply "If I can think of tiddies, I'm alive". And partly due to the fact that the current sum of human knowledge have only done nothing but theories towards what the consciousness is, so I'm comfortable with this conclusion for now.

 

[someonesomeguy]

Well, this is kinda philosophical - am I still I when I wake up?
I certainly can not answer that question. We will have to burrow too deep into the concept of I itself, which is out of my comfort zone.

To me, a human being is not just a specific configuration of particles or substances. These are just a medium. The movement of chemical substances and electrical signals aids in generating the psyche, but the result is stable. Most likely, this is related to memory. And the memory has a physical substrate in the brain.

The brain activity leads to changes in the synaptic connections between some of the neurons. Imagine building a city. When you learn something new that stays in the form of a deeply rooted memory, a new street or alley is constructed in your brain. Later travelling that new path will bring back the memory. Of course, this is something I have read about long-term memories. I am not so sure about the short-term memory, but there should be ways for its preservation before it is forgotten or engraved in the form of a long-term memory path.

Anyway, I think these personal changes to the brain structure, combined with the storm of current activity generated by the movement of substances and signals make you yourself.

By the way, the state of sleeping is not like you shut down a computer. The computer is still working in the background. There are two types of sleep REM and non-REM, and REM sleep shows activity similar to the state of being awake. Therefore it is best to think of this as a continuous operation and not something temporary switched on and off. REM sleep is related to memorizing, while non-REM is related to the real rest period. It shouldn't be all that different from you daydreaming and not paying attention in class. Yet you are still you even when you are distracted and don't pay attention to the stimuli around you.

About the travelling process: The cells don't move in different parts of the brain. It is a relay. Receptors can generate a signal because of a stimuli over a certain threshold. Then that signal is transported thanks to the polarisation of cell membranes. This process is regulated by ion transport and ion gradients across the membrane. When the signal needs to jump from one cell to another, it is converted from electrical to chemical (this is the so-called chemical synapse, bruh there are electrical synapses as well but nvm that now). By travelling over this long path the signal is modified. Well, that's it basically. Very basically...

Ah, just about the plants: it is not really a decision making, it is an innate behavioural response - answer to certain stimuli. It includes taxis, tropism, etc.

I thought i should clarify why i thought only electrons are conscious. My train of thought which lead to it.
When i am conscious . My thoughts are constantly changing . What i am seeing is constantly changing.
So the logic follows that something in my brain which contains conscious should also be changing with my thoughts.

Because how can the parts of brain which aren't changing produce a result which is changing.
Like if a rock is constantly changing color then something inside the rock must also be changing right.

So if conscious things are changing then only the things which are changing must be conscious. Because if something does not change(any change) or move while i am conscious then it is not contributing to my consciousness. Because even if i was unconscious it would still be unchanging.
So it is making no difference in me being conscious or not.
Something must change while i am conscious for it to contribute to consciousness.

Now when i am conscious lots of brain parts don't change . Like lots of neurons don't activate. So they aren't conscious at the moment.

Now what is actually changing.
Ions are changing and moving. Electrons are moving or changing.

So one of them should be conscious. I don't think ions are fast enough changing to produce consciousness so electrons must be conscious.






EDIT
wait now i think about it nucleus releasing electrons or accepting electrons can also be considered changing.
Like maybe some parameter in nucleus changes we don't know about . Maybe nucleus wobbles a bit.
and if they accept and release electrons they are also changing at same rate and speed as electrons so they can keep up with conciousness .
Ok that did kind of invalidate my idea. but still electrons moving around in space making consciousness feels more intuitive .(well intution doesn't really mean shit soooo)