About Love Interests...

[Kureous]

I don't typically do this, but I feel like ranting about something I've seen happen so many times. I'm currently watching Bleach, and I loved Orihime's character at the very beginning. I love the idea of an orphan who lost her only family(her brother in an accident) and who could still move past that and learn to smile. To me, that's a strong character, and I found it not only made her endearing but also added a layer of depth to her, so why then, did they strip all her potential away when she fell in love with Ichigo? Why did her entire character have to suddenly revolve around him? They essentially took a character I liked and made me hate her with the way she started acting, and now, at episode 123, I don't even have any hopes that she'll change.

Let's look at a more recent example. I love Tensura to pieces, but I have a problem with the female characters. Shuna was an Ogre Princess, and so many things could've been done with that fact alone. Maybe she had a special type of upbringing that kind of warped the way she saw the world. Maybe Rimuru, with his otherworld common sense, could help her work through that and actually create genuine chemistry between them, but nope. He named her, she fell in love for some reason, and now, her character is "hahaha funny yandere. Hahaha," who also knows how to cook.

I find it so infuriating. Why does this happen so often? Why strip away all the ambition, personal motivation, and pretty much anything that made them interesting characters in the first place when they fall in love? It's not natural, and worse yet, it's boring. Female characters who get assassinated like this usually become bland, one-dimensional characters, and it's especially painful to watch it happen to a character I originally liked.

 

[Corty]

You just discovered my gripe with many stories, including good ones.

I think it's because the author never had a relationship and doesn't know how to write one.

Or peer pressure to satisfy the majority of virgin buying force who think a relationship is like being the sun and everything else orbits around them.

Edit:

Oh, and I also think they think that such writing would take away from the agency of the MC because a cool MC saves the day and does everything by himself. You can't have others fill that role or help.him out.

 

[TheEldritchGod]

Well, its because the moment a woman falls in love she becomes a one-dimensional being who's sole focus is his penis. Happens all the time.

Or it's because that part of the story is finished and therefore boring so the author moves on to something else that doesn't involve dealing with FEELINGS and MOTIVATIONS. YUCK! Better if she just blushes at his 6-pack abs, gets very jealous over easily fixed misunderstandings that only continue because people don't talk to one another, then fade away into obscurity so the MC can Kamehameha for 12 episodes and explode his plasma blast all over the place.

Chicks dig it when a guy Kamehamehas his plasma.

 

[Nevafrost]

You spoke my mind.

 

[TheEldritchGod]

The fact is some stories are geared toward women, and some towards men. So if the story is for men, don't be surprised if women are one-dimensional. Because in researching my book, I read SO MUCH otome female-centric manga it ain't funny and the men are treated like goddamn doormats.

You think women get the short end of the stick? They at least get some. Usually one guy is chosen and the rest all gotta beta cuck themselves saying, "I'm so happy the woman I love is getting the man she wants and it isn't me."

In male focused stories, the females take a backseat to what would appeal to men.
In female focused stories the MEN take a backseat to what would appeal to women.

Reducing the gender that you aren't trying to appeal to until they are one-dimensional cardboard cut out happens to men and women because of SALES. Men want women who love them. Women want rich men to shower them with complements and gifts. AND THAT'S WHAT THEY WANT TO READ.

So, you give it to them if you want their money.

If you try to appeal to both, nobody wants to buy your story.

 

[Indicterra]

Shuna was an Ogre Princess, and so many things could've been done with that fact alone. Maybe she had a special type of upbringing that kind of warped the way she saw the world. Maybe Rimuru, with his otherworld common sense, could help her work through that and actually create genuine chemistry between them, but nope. He named her, she fell in love for some reason, and now, her character is "hahaha funny yandere. Hahaha," who also knows how to coo

Prolly cause you can't see the story from their pov, Tensura for the most part revolve around Rimuru and how Rimuru sees the world running, and shuna does not have much screen time if remember correctly.

Everything happens to her, every thought she had, every dreams she see and every action she take, all of it happen in background unless it involves Rimuru or the story as a whole.

In short she doesn't have much screen time, she is seemed to be a one dimensional character is prolly because we only see on side of her, even that side that is shown might not be her best side

But the side relavent for the story, after all she is just a supporting character

 

[LilRora]

I think there are three main reasons for that.

One, fantasy written by a man. That, in itself, says a lot, even though I feel like it shouldn't.

Two, there's a really bad and common... I don't know, preconception, assumption, that is especially prevalent in Japanese webnovels, that all events that are important to the plot or characters have to happen on screen. That in itself isn't nearly that bad, but it can be reasonably used only in stories with a narrow focus - in regards to love interests, that's basically only romance, and not harem, and it gets more and more difficult the more characters we add (I think both Tensura and Bleach are known for having a lot of characters).

Why is it bad in that case? Because when there's too many characters, trying to develop all of them organically on screen is practically impossible. When it's impossible to develop all of them, those that aren't developed get sidelined and remain constant - because remember, all important events happen on screen. And that, in turn, leads to simplifications and generalizations like those you described. Because even if there's no time to develop a character, it has to be somehow interesting or attract the audience, which results in those oversimplified, inorganic, cliche characters.

Also, the third, connected reason is a fairly common misconception, rooted perhaps in possessiveness? I'm not entirely sure, but there's often that instinctive sort of fear that when a love interest or a crush or a partner does important things and perhaps changes not on screen, it means they're leaving out the main character - did their feelings change? are they doing something behind their back? Of course it's usually irrational and has little to do with reality, but it's there, and the easiest way to get rid of it is, well, getting rid of the cause, and keeping the character focused where it doesn't cause problems. If it's a good idea though - that's a different matter.

There's a ton of better ways to solve this, but doing that sort of thing is decidedly the simplest solution for the author.

 

[Kureous]

Prolly cause you can't see the story from their pov, Tensura for the most part revolve around Rimuru and how Rimuru sees the world running, and shuna does not have much screen time if remember correctly.

Everything happens to her, every thought she had, every dreams she see and every action she take, all of it happen in background unless it involves Rimuru or the story as a whole.

In short she doesn't have much screen time, she is seemed to be a one dimensional character is prolly because we only see on side of her, even that side that is shown might not be her best side

But the side relavent for the story, after all she is just a supporting character

I've read Tensura up to volume 21, and the only notable character development I've seen for the female Ogres was Shion learning how to cook. There was probably also something there about her realizing she was jealous of Diablo, but saying that Shuna didn't get enough screen time is a weak argument. These characters were introduced in volume 2, and if Fuze could dedicate almost an entire volume(11) to Chloe's confusing time-traveling journey, I don't see why they had to be treated like that. Tensura is one of my favorite isekai, but I don't make excuses for it. It's great at worldbuilding and power fantasy but not so great with its characters, maybe because it has so many, as @LilRora said...

 

[TheEldritchGod]

One, fantasy written by a man. That, in itself, says a lot, even though I feel like it shouldn't

Might be anecdotal, but personal experience has shown me when a woman writes a man's fantasy, it's ten times worse. Men want a woman blindly in love with him. Women think men want women who are psychologically dominated and weak.

Men don't care how weak or strong a woman is, just how loyal. She can be fierce and independent, or meek and subservient, but if she isn't happy being with you, it eats at the man. We might not be the most observant lot, but we do catch on eventually.

A man sees negative feelings as a problem to solve. It's what's beaten into us at a young age. No one cares about you, except your mother, and even then it's conditional. Our negative feelings are problems to be solved, not something to experience. Women get to be sad, Men don't. A man's suffering is taboo and a thing of Shane.

So when we see an unhappy woman we care about, we want to fix those feelings. If we solve the problem, the negative feelings should go away. Right? It's how we live, so we don't understand why a woman would want to be unhappy and cry.

Women who write men don't understand this. At least most of them. So they write deep and brooding men who's heart only """""she"""" can heal. When in Reality, we're usually fine. So when a woman writes the story trying to appeal to men, dear God does it get messed up. 95% focus on sex and control when for 80% of the men, the point of having sex with a woman is to get her to enjoy it.

When the story turns to all about domination and the man getting off and not giving a crap about his partners feelings, 90% of the time I find the author was a woman, or a progressive male suffering from nice guy syndrome.

 

[ACertainPassingUser]

Well, writing by a man or woman Author didnt matter that much if the writer is properly skilled and have consultant at bay.

Audience target matter more, as with Author quality too.

Skilled Female author writing wishfulfilment action story targeted for man, and skilled Male author writing romance story targeted for women.

That happens a lot.