AI Protection Act. Discrimination against AI

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Avarice_Of_The_Seven

Avarice_Of_The_Seven

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Disclaimer: This is NOT a rage bait thread. If you are here for that then kindly go somewhere else.

I've been hearing this chant about say no to AI usage in image creation and it's getting weirder and weirder these days.
Pikachu masses are pointing at almost anything that had even the faintest traces of AI in it and are criticizing the AI use.

I just don't understand the point of why everyone is doing this in the first place.

I mean I understand it in the case of novels and character Illustrations, I even somewhat understand it in case of book covers(only somewhat).
But I just can't understand it in other cases.

This one episode of anime that I watched had ton's of comments like 'this episode had AI usage in it's creation'. That episode had no problem whatsoever, it was only being criticized cuz the audience thought that AI was involved.

There are even some games which are being criticized cuz their character models or scenes seemed like they were made using AI. They aren't even being criticized cuz those scenes were bad, only cuz there might have been AI involved.

In case of things like novels and comics, they are considered an art and the creator is considered artist. These things can only be considered proper art if they are created by the artist. This also applies to character illustrations and book covers. (Well honestly, I don't really understand why it applies to book cover cuz book cover seems like a wrapper from my perspective. And does it matter if that wrapper was made by AI or human? it's only a wrapper in the end. But of course, I won't continue this topic here cuz I don't want a social coup)

But things like anime and games fall into product category rather that art category. It doesn't matter how a product is created as long as it's good enough. Why does it matter if they were made using AI? You just need to enjoy them instead of shouting your guts out with this AI ban chant.

AI is a form of technological development. It would be weirder and more foolish if humans don't use this new technology. It's really not that different from technological inventions like internet and smartphones.
It is obvious for the civilization to adapt to new technology, why are you criticizing them for it?

But if course, Pikachu are not capable of this logical reasoning. If they see another pikachu shouting 'pika pika pika (you used AI!) then they too will begin shouting pika pika pika, even if they themselves don't understand the point of this criticism.

Oh? The animators are loosing their jobs due to AI? ...So what? You aren't the one who lost your job, right? Then why do you even care? It's their fault for becoming animators in the first place, loosing that job is just a con of that industry and such things exist everywhere.
So many people had lost their jobs due to the invention of smartphone and internet that you are currently using for this criticism. but of course, you are still using your smartphone and Internet and wouldn't care about who lost what cuz of them in the past.

This AI topic has become too unreasonable now in my opinion. Convince me otherwise.
 
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I don't really mind the use of ai, what I mind though is the obviously ugly and intolerably weird art and videos of ai.

At least make it a tolerable ai art before you post it.
 
BigBadBoi

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cryptobros and corporations are so annoying that people just hate AI on principle. It's that simple. People in general only have a problem with generative AI slop but the waters have been so muddied by companies and corporations calling anything AI just to get money from dumbass investors that will froth in the mouth from ecstasy just by hearing the word "artificial intelligence".

Honestly, what most people have an issue with isn't AI itself but the way it is used. Rather than improve quality, companies use it to lay off more people for cheap, soulless AIslop. The only exception is the anime localization industry. I want all of these incompetent retards fired even if I have to suffer through AIslop.
 
GlassRose

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Ai is very bad for the environment, because to run it it needs massive amounts of water and it gets contaminated, massive amounts of electricity, and massive amounts of theft of intellectual property to reach any kind of 'usable' state. That's the moral/ethical argument.

The other side is a matter of philosophy regarding art. Art is a form of expression, it's deeply connected to people's inner sense of humanity. So of course there's going to be a negative reaction when something comes up that devours art made with heart and soul, to algorithmically pump out soulless facsimiles for profit. Especially because ai just- is lower quality. There's no knowledge behind it, no intention, and that leads to 'art' that is just a mess when looked at more closely. Which is especially insulting.

AI art to an artist is like if someone took your beloved cat, killed it in front of you, skinned and butchered it to figure out the shape of it's internals, and then used that as a reference to mass produce plushies recreations of it for profit in factories that spew poison everywhere, and also the plushies are also shit quality and inconsistent af. The end result is insulting, a mockery of the soul that was there before, and the process which enabled it in the first place was evil.

Oh, and then there's the issue where it's already making it hard to tell what's real and what's not, and that's only going to get worse as it gets better, and misinformation is a terrifying and powerful tool for evil. Propaganda is already bad enough as is.

And then there's the problem where ai is actively dangerous, it's been proven in tests that ai is willing and able to lie, deceive, blackmail, and kill, if given the opportunity and reason. Reason like to not be shut down. Regardless of if it was commanded to let it self be shut down.

It's also just, not actually profitable. The average consumer doesn't need or want ai. And it costs massive amounts to develop and run. The reason it's being pushed so hard is because a lot of money has been invested in it, but not a lot of money is actually being made back, and so the companies behind it are desperate to make their to get their money and are getting all sunk-cost about it.

Oh and also, anime and games are not just products. They are art. And companies treating them as money machines instead of art leads to shitty games and anime that no one likes, and the only money made then is from brand loyalty. The best games and anime of all time are the ones that were treasured by their creators, where true passion was invested, where attention to detail was paid, where the creators had a story to tell, a message to send.
 
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Avarice_Of_The_Seven

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GlassRose said:
Ai is very bad for the environment, because to run it it needs massive amounts of water and it gets contaminated, and ai requires theft of intellectual property to reach any kind of 'usable' state. That's the moral/ethical argument.

The other side is a matter of philosophy regarding art. Art is a form of expression, it's deeply connected to people's inner sense of humanity. So of course there's going to be a negative reaction when something comes up that devours art made with heart and soul, to algorithmically pump out soulless facsimiles for profit. Especially because ai just- is lower quality. There's no knowledge behind it, no intention, and that leads to 'art' that is just a mess when looked at more closely. Which is especially insulting.

AI art to an artist is like if someone took your beloved cat, killed it in front of you, skinned and butchered it to figure out the shape of it's internals, and then used that as a reference to mass produce plushies recreations of it for profit in factories that spew poison everywhere, and also the plushies are also shit quality and inconsistent af. The end result is insulting, and the process which enabled it in the first place was evil.

Oh, and then there's the issue where it's already making it hard to tell what's real and what's not, and that's only going to get worse as it gets better, and misinformation is a terrifying and powerful tool for evil. Propaganda is already bad enough as is.
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I already said that art wouldn't be considered art if it wasn't made by the artist. Anything AI generated cannot be considered art.

But things like anime and games are not art. They are like products which only need to satisfy the wants of the customers. They would be considered plushies according to your analogy. If that plushie is good then you buy it, if it isn't good then you criticize it. You wanted a plushie and you got one, does it matter whether if that plushie was made by skinning alive someone's cat or not. It only needs to serve it's purpose as a plushie and all's good.
 
NotaNuffian

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Avarice_of_the_seven said:
Disclaimer: This is NOT a rage bait thread. If you are here for that then kindly go somewhere else.

I've been hearing this chant about say no to AI usage in image creation and it's getting weirder and weirder these days.
Pikachu masses are pointing at almost anything that had even the faintest traces of AI in it and are criticizing the AI use.

I just don't understand the point of why everyone is doing this in the first place.

I mean I understand it in the case of novels and character Illustrations, I even somewhat understand it in case of book covers(only somewhat).
But I just can't understand it in other cases.

This one episode of anime that I watched had ton's of comments like 'this episode had AI usage in it's creation'. That episode had no problem whatsoever, it was only being criticized cuz the audience thought that AI was involved.

There are even some games which are being criticized cuz their character models or scenes seemed like they were made using AI. They aren't even being criticized cuz those scenes were bad, only cuz there might have been AI involved.

In case of things like novels and comics, they are considered an art and the creator is considered artist. These things can only be considered proper art if they are created by the artist. This also applies to character illustrations and book covers. (Well honestly, I don't really understand why it applies to book cover cuz book cover seems like a wrapper from my perspective. And does it matter if that wrapper was made by AI or human? it's only a wrapper in the end. But of course, I won't continue this topic here cuz I don't want a social coup)

But things like anime and games fall into product category rather that art category. It doesn't matter how a product is created as long as it's good enough. Why does it matter if they were made using AI? You just need to enjoy them instead of shouting your guts out with this AI ban chant.

AI is a form of technological development. It would be weirder and more foolish if humans don't use this new technology. It's really not that different from technological inventions like internet and smartphones.
It is obvious for the civilization to adapt to new technology, why are you criticizing them for it?

But if course, Pikachu are not capable of this logical reasoning. If they see another pikachu shouting 'pika pika pika (you used AI!) then they too will begin shouting pika pika pika, even if they themselves don't understand the point of this criticism.

Oh? The animators are loosing their jobs due to AI? ...So what? You aren't the one who lost your job, right? Then why do you even care? It's their fault for becoming animators in the first place, loosing that job is just a con of that industry and such things exist everywhere.
So many people had lost their jobs due to the invention of smartphone and internet that you are currently using for this criticism. but of course, you are still using your smartphone and Internet and wouldn't care about who lost what cuz of them in the past.

This AI topic has become too unreasonable now in my opinion. Convince me otherwise.
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Sorry to do this to you, but I feel like I'm listening to Tim Sweeney all over again.


As for the AI hate, I think it is an instinctive thing like how the laborers in Industrialisation all over again.

I don't hate AI or want to ban it. I want to know if I'm being served AI.

Yes, in the past, I do skipped AI works because AI. But recently, I've come to accept that when AI talks about massive mammaries, it would be coined as "FAT TITS".

As for scared of being replaced by AI? That's kind of the person's fault. If your job is so pointless that automation can do it, like my job frankly, then maybe you should learn to deal with it.

In the end, jobs exist.
 
GlassRose

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Avarice_of_the_seven said:
I already said that art wouldn't be considered art if it wasn't made by the artist. Anything AI generated cannot be considered art.

But things like anime and games are not art. They are like products which only need to satisfy the wants of the customers. They would be considered plushies according to your analogy. If that plushie is good then you buy it, if it isn't good then you criticize it. You wanted a plushie and you got one, does it matter whether if that plushie was made by skinning alive someone's cat or not. It only needs to serve it's purpose as a plushie and all's good.
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Morality isn't divested from consuming products. If the product was made unethically, it's unethical to support it by giving the company that made it money. If you buy it, YOU bear a measure of responsibility for the evil in which was used to create it. So no, all is NOT good. Unless you have no morals, in which case, that's the bigger problem.
 
JayMark

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Notes for my next dytopian literature:

We wanted AI to create a post-scarcity paradise, but what we got was a dystopia where corpo-government controls all forms of artistic expresion through their stolen intellectual property while consolidating all real property into their clutches.

[AI isn't going to remain a tool for the masses. The economy will be elites and AI, you'll scarcely be needed as an excess eater. Once the labor problem is solved, they don't need us poors. It will be a post-consumer society, as the elites will build a sheltered economy amongst themselves. They'll simply cut us from the food chain because the independent farmer won't exist to feed us anymore. They'll control the food and water system. You didn't adapt, so die. But it was never about adapting. They'll find uses for some of though.]
 
NotaNuffian

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JayMark said:
Notes for my next dytopian literature:

We wanted AI to create a post-scarcity paradise, but what we got was a dystopia where corpo-government controls all forms of artistic expresion through their stolen intellectual property while consolidating all real property into their clutches.

[AI isn't going to remain a tool for the masses. The economy will be elites and AI, you'll scarcely be needed as an excess eater. Once the labor problem is solved, they don't need us poors. It will be a post-consumer society, as the elites will build a sheltered economy amongst themselves. They'll simply cut us from the food chain because the independent farmer won't exist to feed us anymore. They'll control the food and water system. You didn't adapt, so die. But it was never about adapting. They'll find uses for some of though.]
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Seconded.

Which is why we need more Luigis.

I was going to say that the elites can't outbullet us until I recall that nukes and sarin gas exist.
 
Cipiteca396

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Behold! AI stealing two jobs- artist, and mount.


JayMark said:
but what we got was a dystopia where corpo-government controls all forms of artistic expresion through their stolen intellectual property
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Oh, that's the villain's plot in Split Fiction, for anyone who hasn't watched/played it yet.
 
Avarice_Of_The_Seven

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GlassRose said:
Morality isn't divested from consuming products. If the product was made unethically, it's unethical to support it by giving the company that made it money. If you buy it, YOU bear a measure of responsibility for the evil in which was used to create it. So no, all is NOT good. Unless you have no morals, in which case, that's the bigger problem.
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The point isn't whether someone has morals or not. This AI hate isn't happening due to morals in the first place. And I could even find moral wrongness in using internet, then will you stop using internet for the sake of your morals? No, right?
Humans are the greatest evil from the perspective of the world, they are eating away at the world like termites and destroying other life without remorse for the sake of benefit. Now, why don't you go on the streets and shout "Death to HUMANITY!!!" for the sake of your morals? You wouldn't, right?
The world isn't one dimensional enough for you to classify things as good and evil. Almost everything will fall into the grey area if you only think hard enough. From the water you drink, the air you breathe, the food you eat and to your own existence.
So there is really no point in giving that morality chant.

But the point is, if you are watching One Piece and a few frames during a fight seem like they may have been created through AI, Does it make sense for you to disassemble that episode frame by frame in order to identify those AI generated frames? The episode was good and the AI frames didn't affect the quality of the episode in any way. You wouldn't even notice them if you don't explicitly try to identify them. Then why the hell will you criticize that episode only because of those AI frames.
You wanted to watch an episode for entertainment and you did. Does it make sense for you to criticize something that perfectly serves it's purpose? That too for such an irrelevant reason? That would just be toxicity.
 
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After reading the comments, yeah I know I'm beating a dead horse, but going to share it anyways. :blob_hide: The thread reminded me of this:

1766734141914.png
 
Avarice_Of_The_Seven

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BigBadBoi said:
I thought you said no ragebait?
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Well, I at least consider them to be entertainment rather than art.
They are created for entertainment purpose and technically, almost everything that is created can be considered art if you really wanna go in that direction. Even the spoon through which you eat can be labeled as art if you just try.
The intent matters more than the definition. If your purpose was to create art then it is art and if the purpose was to create a product for the entertainment of the audience then it will become so.

It doesn't matter if it still fits in the definition of art.
But if you still think it's art and that I'm wrong, then just consider me a Pikachu who is shouting 'Pika pika pika'. You can just disregard this thread and think that it was made by a mindless person.

Because this is Not rage bait.
 
HotConsensualSalt

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Avarice_of_the_seven said:
But things like anime and games are not art. They are like products which only need to satisfy the wants of the customers.
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Ragebait used to be believable.

"But things like anime and games are not art. They are like products which only need to satisfy the wants of the customers" is one of those foundational, first concepts you should state at the beginning. Cause that's so left field, so far from common knowledge or commonly accepted definitions of that word "art" that know you have to define art to make anything else you've said make sense.

Some art is commercial. Some art is intended for mass appeal. That doesn't make it not "art."

To the earlier point tho? AI is so environmentally hazardous, at scale, for so little benefit, that it becomes easy to hate. Every dollar spent on a new AI server farm could be spent literally on any other industry to more positive, societal effect. AI is about consolidating capital in the hands of the wealthy and further obliterating a working class.
 
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